Battenkill - Forum Archive

Apr 08, 2013 at 05:27 PM

This is what I'm seeing on the registration page, along with start times. I looked for those registered with Kissena as their team. I cross-referenced start times from theguide, but definitely double-check the start times, in case there are updates, or something's a typo. This is data, after all, and it gets loaded wrong all the time. Shout out if I missed you on the list.

CAT 3 A 9:50am

Joseph Mueller

Ryan Johnston

Daniel Hubbard

John Malcolmson

Vlad Preoteasa

CAT 3 B 10:00

Keith Snyder

CAT 4 C 10:40

Ian Ellis

Alyosha Smolarski

Jeffrey White

Joel de la Garza

Peter Bysshe

Joshua Caesar

Andrew Da Silva

Konrad Ratzmann

Bruce van-Schalkwyk

Matthew Arlyck

Cat 4F 11:10

Adam Naguib

Men 45+ 1-4 11:20

Tony Markovina

Cat 5A Under 35 11:40

Floris Backervanommeren

mark clifford

Cat 5J 45+ 1:10

James Gironta

Thierry Bonnaire

Cat 5 N 55+ 1:50

Joseph Iberti

Jeffrey White

Apr 08, 2013 at 05:42 PM

So, Adam and Keith are in the wrong fields?

Jules

Apr 08, 2013 at 05:57 PM

This race more than most reccomend Pre-riding the final 5-10km two or three times.

Note the landmarks and think about maneuvering into that final corner

Jules

Apr 08, 2013 at 05:58 PM

Joel is in California.

josephmueller

Apr 08, 2013 at 06:00 PM

Keith signed up late. and I feel like John said he wasn't going to race cat 3s and do masters, but I might be wrong

JohnMalcolmson

Apr 08, 2013 at 06:24 PM

Thanks JP!

tito

Apr 08, 2013 at 08:37 PM

Sadly, dudes it's down to the wire for me tonight so I can't make it to the talk after all. Thanks JP for your availability and flexibility as always.

I'd love to crib some notes from anyone who attends.

vlad

Apr 08, 2013 at 10:20 PM

I was hoping to make this, but I'm stuck at work. Sorry I'm missing this.

konrad

Apr 08, 2013 at 10:59 PM

I am not going to be making it to Battenkill this year. I've been sick (fever, fatigue, and all the nasty junk you can imagine in the lungs/throat) and thus not riding very much at all for the past 2 weeks. Beyond that, my Spooky's damn integrated headtube/cable stop thing failed this past weekend so I'm left with a road frame that's unable to hold cables.

So so so bummed.

alyoshas

Apr 09, 2013 at 12:12 AM

sorry to hear konrad! take care of ur health and your bike's- see u soon hopefully.

dstokes

Apr 09, 2013 at 12:50 AM

I have great expectations for cat3a. After RvM, you should be prepared and be able to have plan.

E.g. Send Vlad early.

have Malcomson counter.

Save Ryan and Joe for the finale.

Jules

Apr 09, 2013 at 01:15 AM

Damn Konrad. Take the rage and focus it on the next hilly race

There is some nasty stuff going around - Nasty.

Floris Backer van Ommeren

Apr 09, 2013 at 03:03 AM

I'm also sorry I couldn't make it, just got home from work..Anybody wants to share meeting notes? I'm happy to buy post-race waffles in return

btw, the organization put a couple of videos online on Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/battenkill?ref=stream

mugwump

Apr 09, 2013 at 03:10 AM

Battenkillaz,

Newbies to this event would do well to go back to the beginning of this thread. Lots of race reports and insight.

Bruce van-Schalkwyk

Apr 09, 2013 at 03:52 AM

Thanks for the talk, JP!

I'll write more later - need some sleep for tomorrow's ride.

Thierry Bonnaire

Apr 09, 2013 at 01:59 PM

Our gratitude to JP who came all the way from Harlem to provide us some critical information about the race.

JohnMalcolmson

Apr 09, 2013 at 08:24 PM

@Stokes, that sounds similar to our strategy last year—Jeff Condon and Alyoshas were out there for a good twenty minutes in the second half. In hindsight I felt dangling a couple of guys off the front was a wasteful tactic. As you know, it's such a race of attrition, the distance whittles it down to 20 or so (cramping) riders. I think It's a given that if we protect Joe and Ryan from the wind and work they will be in the lead group at the finish.

What was interesting last year was Vollbach's move that tore the field apart, I think Vlad and I doing that in a cross wind with Joe and Ryan on our wheels might be worth the investment. If the wind is right (right now West at 12mph), that same section will be equally as decisive. There's 150 riders in our field, multiple strong teams with depth. I think just keeping Ryan and Joe at the front should be our goal. Let's not count out Vlad for podium either, he's been doing miles and racing 123 50 miler's. He could be our guy to slip away solo in the last couple of miles.

Jules

Apr 09, 2013 at 08:40 PM

John Malcolmson said:

a good twenty minutes in the second half. In hindsight I felt dangling a couple of guys off the front was a wasteful tactic. As you know, it's such a race of attrition, the distance whittles it down to 20 or so (cramping) riders. I think It's a given that if we protect Joe and Ryan from the wind and work they will be in the lead group at the finish.

What was interesting last year was Vollbach's move that tore the field apart, I think Vlad and I doing that in a cross wind with Joe and Ryan on our wheels might be worth the investment. If the wind is

Dead on, John. Specifically that flat, gravelly section ("Cheese Hill Road?") put a lot of guys permanently into the hurt locker.

If Ryan & Joe can stay in the wheels till the bitter end it'll be carnage - the good kind. If you guys have time I'd scout in a car the few km's before that flat gravel section and then make damn sure the guys are on good wheels when the time comes to stomp.

Bruce van-Schalkwyk

Apr 10, 2013 at 01:01 AM

I took away a quite a lot of info from the talk, and put together some of the major points I'm thinking about, based on what JP said. I'm going to search through the BK discussion to see if some of this is reiterated or see if I got it completely wrong.

Eat at mile 20 and 40

For me, getting to the GWB is 18 miles, when I usually stop to have a Gu anyway, so these are good miles for me to keep in mind. I'm going to carry Gu and Blocks, like I always do. Blocks will be opened before the race.

3 Bottles. I'm going to have Accelerade up front, Gatorade cut with water in back, and a bottle of water in my jersey, and attempt to stay away from feed stations unless absolutely necessary.

If I need water, nice and slow, hand out level with my bars, bring the bottle to my chest when they hand it, toss mine low and level.

Get up to the front early and before any dirt sections, and hold my line on the dirt. I want to leave as much room ahead of me as reasonable in case someone goes down. Can't predict that, but as I get tired, everyone else will be also. And 23mm tires will be fine. I looked through my tire stash and only had 1 new one so put a new 23mm on front, 25mm on the rear. I'm drinking beer tonight, so I think the 25 is a good idea back there. I'll get some riding in before the race to make sure there are no issues and wear them in a bit.

Don't worry too much about the hills because the descents will give me time to catch up, if I'm behind. And keep in mind others will be catching up to me. They're going to be hard, as they always are. Do what I can, steady pacing, spin.

I've made rides like this every weekend up to Piermont for a couple of years. This will be harder and faster, but I'm used to hills and then long straights, rollers, riding next to other people. This is a race, like all the others, exciting and difficult. Calm energy, aggressive positioning, confidence that the guy next to me hurts more than I do.

Despite JP's warnings, I will probably piss in my shorts. So be it. Hey, I'm going to have a bottle of water in my jersey. . .

Nothing new before the race. I will not have baked Alaska or homemade blueberry pie at the diner (mmm, pie). I generally load up on carbs before a race, mainly because I'm nervous and I like to eat. Keep it simple. Follow my routine.

Ride like a motha' trukin demon. Push. Position. Help my team. Win.

Oh, and have fun.

Peter Bysshe

Apr 10, 2013 at 02:19 AM

Sorry for the delayed response on the Hammer Questions:

Race Day Boost (Capsules) - for PEAK races only . . .

Tuesday 2 at Breakfast / 2 at Lunch + 2 scoops of Recoverite with each dosage (or one scoop of Hammer Whey if you are sensitive to calories to maintain race weight.)

Wednesday & Thursday 2 at each meal (take it after your taper workouts not before) + 2 scoops of Recoverite with each dosage (or one scoop of Hammer Whey if you are sensitive to calories to maintain race weight.)

Friday 2 caps 4x over the course of the day. I personally add my last dose before bed. + 2 scoops of Recoverite with each dosage (or one scoop of Hammer Whey if you are sensitive to calories to maintain race weight.)

Saturday - NO RACE DAY BOOST.

Peter Bysshe

Apr 10, 2013 at 02:24 AM

Hammer on race day to respond to Jeff White's question:

If you have practiced your fueling, skip breakfast and start on Perpetuem as soon as you start to feel hungry. Remember your rate is personal. Here's exactly how I PERSONALLY do it . . . because this is what I practice. I weight 151lbs for big races and 156ish for the rest of the year. My resting heart is 42, my FTP was 290W at best last year and is currently down closer to 260W. Fun winter skiing with toddlers. Oh well.

Here's how I do it.

I write out tabs for each bottle on small scraps of paper with the times and ingredients on them. They are held on to the bottle by screwing the top down on them. They sit labeled like this without adding the water until at the race. I do this so that I know EXACTLY what I have vs. the anticipated weather. There are 5 bottles + water: WAKE, WARMUP, RACE, RESERVE, RECOVERY + WATER

10:40am Start

WAKE & DRIVE 7am [ FRS / 2P / 2E ]

Large Bottle

FRS for morning flavour / 2 Perpetuem Scoops / 2 Endurolyte caps or scoops

+ regular dose of Hammer Daily Essentials (Race Caps, Mito Caps, Premium Insurance Caps)

COFFEE Like any other day.

WARMUP 9:30 - [FRS / 1P / 3E / 2EA / 2AF]

Large Bottle

FRS for flavor and caffeine / 1 Perpetuem Scoop / 3 Enduro caps or scoops / 2 Endurance Amino Caps / 2 Anti-fatigue

RACE 10:30 - [8P / 8E / 4EA / 8AF]

Large bottle + Large Water (+1 small extra water if it's hot)

This is a 4 hour bottle for me . . . I run at about 2 Perpetuems an hour unless I get a flat or find myself leading out early attacks for others and then fading into a leisurely finish (that's when you get REALLY f'n hungry and cramped) so 8 scoops / 8 Endurolytes / 4 Endurance Aminos / 8 Anti-Fatigues.

RESERVE [4P / 4E / 2EA / 8AF]

Small bottle without water added to go in your shirt

RECOVERY [3R / 4EA ]

Large Bottle - dry in car + Gallon jug of water on standby

3 scoops Recoverite / 4 Endurance Aminos

CHOCOLATE MILK [ from podium only]

In my pocket I carry a 3 Hammer film canister type tubes all with labels and tactile differences taped on to them so you aren't guessing which is which when you reach in your pocket: Endurolytes (to share with your cramping friends), Anti-fatigue Caps (with a toothpick taped on the side) & then Perpetuem Solids (ribbed and then taped for your pleasure or for emergency starvation because you are out for 5 hours with a broken bike . . .)

So that's my plan this year for what has turned out to be a training ride for ZOFINGEN in late May where I hope to be better prepared.

Peter

(feel free to write directly to peter@hitchcockpartners.com if you have any urgent questions in these last few days)

Ryan J

Apr 10, 2013 at 02:48 AM

@john dangling guys off the front is a wasteful tactic. But as I recall that's not what we meant to do. We wanted other teams to go with them. I recall I tried to get Sids and Siggis to send somebody up to join but they didn't even begin to understand the concept. So they ended up out there alone. Anyway, if I'm being helped what I would want is for teammates to stay in the race for as long as possible to shepherd us where we want to be when it counts and maybe to help if we flat or crash or get caught out before the end. And of course to bring back or cover anything that gets away without us. But I'm not thinking anybody should attack early.

mugwump

Apr 10, 2013 at 03:04 AM

Bruce,

It's not so much "don't worry" on the climbs. More like, "the main objective is to hold position and not crash as the climbs are more about maintaining position and going with big selections rather htan about attacking solo for the win." As you get closer to the finish, the hills will be more critical, but with downhills following each climb, if you're dropped by a little, you can often catch back on, provided you're not exploding.

Jules

Apr 10, 2013 at 04:35 AM

Peter's wheel is hands down the best one to follow on the dirt descents... As Ferris would say, "if you have the means I highly recommend it..."

http://youtu.be/GV2Y2kIUkIs

mugwump

Apr 10, 2013 at 01:04 PM

BTW, please no race day experiments on fueling. The advice is fine, but unless you're tried it in training, you shouldn't be using it on race day.

Jeffrey White

Apr 10, 2013 at 02:21 PM

@Peter - Thanks for such a detailed view into your nutrition regimen! Very meticulous.

I personally really like a large 26 oz. Perpetuem nutrition bottle as well, but I mix it a little thinner -- 1.5 scoops per hour for my somewhat cushy 160 lb. frame. I also add 1-2 scoops per hour of Endurolytes, depending on temperature. I am a salty sweater. That goes in the back cage. I also bring three chocolate Hammer Gels in case I feel the need for something resembling frosting in my belly, which is known to happen. I fully expect to go off the back, so I'll also bring a Hammer Bar for the post-meltdown crampy death march for the milk, which I will obviously buy. Which reminds me, I'll also bring some cash for finish line recovery nutrition. Starving, cash-poor racers wandering around like shell-shocked POWs is an all-too-common sight in the finishing area.

For hydration, I carry a large bottle of water in the front cage, and a small disposable reserve bottle (with a pre-opened squeeze-style cap) in my middle back pocket, which I CAREFULLY jettison at the feed zone.

As for nutrition this week, I'm keeping it pretty normal, except eating a carb-based entree with meals instead of a protein one. I don't think this makes much of a difference, but it can't hurt.

Jules

Apr 10, 2013 at 06:12 PM

Took my recovering knee out for a spin today. Can't tell you how bummed I am not to be tearing it up with you guys at my favorite race.

I don't miss the pressure though

JohnMalcolmson

Apr 11, 2013 at 09:58 PM

Brrrrr, just when you thought it was warming up...

http://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/getForecast?hourly=1&query=05201&yday=102&weekday=Saturday