Myles said:

it's really sad, it's a great event. is it the course has deteriorated to crap, or the course is way to crash worthy, or that NYC racers can't turn four times in .7 mile?

If memory serves, the pavement was re-done a few years back.

The tricky part of this course is that it ends up being quite fast and the turns are tight. And the crown of the road makes you have to pay attention through turn 1.

But honestly, as far as "well deserved reputation for being a crash feat?" I don't know about that. I do know that the crashes usually get caught on camera and passed around the internet; but say there are two crashes per race? Can any of you tell me that there are not two crashes per race at Prospect Park? Or FBF?

There are two to four crashes per race in Wisconsin. Enroute to her second place in the pro race, BrittLee's teammate slid out in the last turn while trying to set up a leadout. You see riders with telfa bandages, mesh wraps and tore up skin suits racing day after day. Fields continue to be the same size from day to day.

But that's no different than our guys when they race at FBF. Even after major wrecks, the first thing they say is, "when can I get back out there?" In fact, I don't know anyone who has crashed at FBF or PP and summarily dismissed those races as crash fests and then eliminated them from their racing calendar. I'm sure there are some though. But raise your healed broken collar bone if you've ever returned to race the venue of your accident!

I don't have stats on the crashes, so I could be wrong about Harlem not being anymore dangerous than any other race, that's what me gut/memory says. It's not more crashy, it just seems like it is.

But I get that not every race is for everyone. That makes sense to me. Obviously no one should do races they aren't comfortable with.

Jeffrey White said:

Nobody wants to do this race because of its well deserved history of being a crashfest. 

This is true.

Also, intersting to hear about insufficient marshaling in light of the egregious sander CRCA heaped on Charlie for the race he set up and ran without incident when Eustice dropped it in his lap at the 11th hour.

#glasshouses

"Also, I agree with Trimble about its safety relative to park races. Dunno, I just see a lot of broken bones in those races too, week in, week out. Even when you ONLY look at Kissena, it's nearly one per month. "--Jeffrey White, 2015

So Red Hook is safe, Harlem is not.   Got it.  

Jules said:

Jeffrey White said:

Nobody wants to do this race because of its well deserved history of being a crashfest. 

This is true.

Which part is true, that nobody wants to do the race, or it has a well deserved history of being a crashfest?  The former is clearly false: people want to do the race.  And the latter needs to be proven, which neither have bothered to do.

Maybe it's the name.  Skyscraper so easily becomes skinscraper.

Maybe it's that crashing at Red Hook is cool.  Crashing at Harlem is not.  

Maybe it's that people think climbing is a legit course feature and corners are not.  (in my mind I can still hear Dan Hubbard italicizing "corners" in his evaluation of the course.)  Shouldn't people be embarrassed that they can't get around four basically 90-degree corners on flat roads quickly and safely?  

As Marc wrote, the only "difficult" corner is turn one, and that's because some folks get scared going from a wide to narrow street and some get scared when they ride over the crown.  Turns two and four you can basically pedal through at any speed.  Turn three you can usually pedal through.

I think Bruce brings up some valid points. As he always does. Yes racing is expensive, and requires a disproportionate amount of dedication to be just a pack finisher, never mind a podium placer.

The issue of burnout is real, and I feel like a few of us talk about this every year as reports of riders doing 20-hour training weeks in February in their living rooms and basements start to filter in. Conversely, we try to encourage participation in pre season group rides, despite less than ideal weather. Many days were ridiculous and unrideable this year for sure, but there were many good days too.

For those who basically took the winter off, we talked about picking and choosing select races this spring, as a way to here and there improve ones fitness without breaking the bank, legs and spirit.Or using April and May as a build into summer. Training Peaks Tim's plans have been a great motivator for many.

So here we are, mid-June, and if you are a person who is both planning on racing cross, and uncomfortable racing unless the fitness is strong, then I recommend starting training now. And if you are dabbling, then it's a good time to focus a bit more.

Ps I'm moving to Portland next week. Haha

I prioritized a TT. Also, I didn't want to do a 3/4. That was my only option. No thanks.

I love this race.

One of the Weather Channel bicycles was stolen yesterday from the race.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=876707344722&set=a.783217783552.1073741827.43101274&type=1&theater

This race used to be on the NRC calendar - is no more.
As of 2 years ago there is a new and sizable police fee - like, a large seven figure fee
(It's always on father's day though)

As someone drooling over a return to the city, how pathetic has the turnout
for city races gotten?

7 figure??? As in x,xxx,xxx?

Myles said:

As someone drooling over a return to the city, how pathetic has the turnout for city races gotten?

Prospect Park races still attract 50+ riders...they just don't really sell out anymore. But that's okay, no one needs to race against 110 dudes in the park in the dark. And there's always enough hammer heads to make you sweat a little.

Adam said:

7 figure??? As in x,xxx,xxx?

No, five figure. typo. I think it was like 75 grand.

Bump!

This is a great race.  Yet not a single Kissena is entered.  (I'm on the fence due to a lingering sickness--going to the doctor today).

Pre-reg closes at 5pm today.

https://www.bikereg.com/harlem-skyscraper-cycling-classic

Hard to justify a 5 lap cat 5 race ... but, is day of registration possible?

Is that a typo?  5 laps??  For $40???

Scott Kuhlke said:

Hard to justify a 5 lap cat 5 race ... but, is day of registration possible?

Understood on the first part.  Considering this is a hometown race, and they should be looking to provide racing for locals, I'd love it if you'd write the promoter and tell him your reason for not registering.

On the second, I believe it is.

I'm thinking of doing the Masters race.  I know this has a reputation of being a crash fest and the last time I raced it, I did indeed crash.  Are my fears unfounded?

I don't think that Cat 5 race would even count for an upgrade, since don't they have to be at least 20 minutes or 15 miles to count for upgrade points? This is only 15 minutes.

Another reason to write to the promoter, why run races that don't allow racers to count it towards their upgrade?

Jeff Condon said:

I'm thinking of doing the Masters race.  I know this has a reputation of being a crash fest and the last time I raced it, I did indeed crash.  Are my fears unfounded?

An RBNY rider told me his team doesn't do Harlem anymore due to something like six of their riders breaking bones in it a few years back. 

Dan Reiners said:

I don't think that Cat 5 race would even count for an upgrade, since don't they have to be at least 20 minutes or 15 miles to count for upgrade points? This is only 15 minutes.

Another reason to write to the promoter, why run races that don't allow racers to count it towards their upgrade?

If someone can let me know who the promoter is / or email address, happy to do so.  There is not an obvious link on BikeReg, and FB account doesn't provide one.

Scott Kuhlke said:

If someone can let me know who the promoter is / or email address, happy to do so.  There is not an obvious link on BikeReg, and FB account doesn't provide one.

use the Contact Event link at the top of the page.

Hmm, that is more obvious than I had anticipated.

I'm signed up.

Turns out I have strep throat.  This means I've done at least five races since last November racing on strep.  Weird how I'm not getting better at it.  Training effect doesn't seem to be working here.

RileyHoonan said:

Jeff Condon said:

I'm thinking of doing the Masters race.  I know this has a reputation of being a crash fest and the last time I raced it, I did indeed crash.  Are my fears unfounded?

An RBNY rider told me his team doesn't do Harlem anymore due to something like six of their riders breaking bones in it a few years back. 

No easy answer.  If you scroll up, you'll see our discussion.

I will posit that I think the masters race is probably safer than the V, IV, or III races.  Older guys are a bit less gung-ho in corners.

David Yang said:

Is that a typo?  5 laps??  For $40???

The Saturday night collarbone special.

Get 'em while they're hot.

I stopped by this afternoon and good to see JP in the 1/2's as well as the women's 1/2's. Looks like a fun race.  I think I'm in next year once I'm a 4 and I can do more than 5 laps. 

It was good to see Scott out of bike clothes.  Starting to recognize him that way.

Jeff Condon raced earlier, in the very safe-looking Masters race.  Saw Phil with his cast and awesome scar, and even he was looking at the banking on turn four, wishing he could be out there.

Once again, a fast field with a strong international contingent showed up (Germans, Kiwis).  53 pre-reg, about 70 starters.  While Foundation and Weather Channel brought their heavy hitters, neither seemed to be in a super-strong position--Scott Savory had Gavi Epstein for guidance, and between the two, Savory should be able to outspent any Foundation train, and there's only so much Mike Margarite can do on his own for Weather Channel (their other guys are better at sprinting).

I didn't know what to expect of my body, as I've been on penicillin since Wednesday to kill of the Strep virus I've been carrying around.  My first goal was to finish, so I expected to start easily and evaluate during the race.

Initially, the race felt relatively easy.  The pace was fast, but not brutal, and everyone was cornering well.

I tried moving up early, but getting into the top 20 took a big effort, so I decided to wait until  half-distance to think about attacking.

Only I missed the lap counter for a while and when I saw it next, there were only eight laps to go.  I tried moving up into the top ten.  I was briefly able to do so, but it was hard to hold.

I find the corners in Harlem very easy in the dry.  Turn three is wide enough to pedal through at race speed.  But I did get a bit overconfident, and clipped a pedal one lap.  Kicked out my rear wheel, but not by much.

I decided I didn't have the juice to attack, then recover and fight for the sprint, so I banked everything on  positioning for the sprint.  With a deep enough field, the final laps can be so fast that the dangerous jockeying doesn't go on, and you don't so much as sprint at the end, but accelerate a bit and hold on.

With four to go, I was up in the top 15.  I was feeling good about this, and the field was riding very safely--the Germans were killing it so much that most people were just trying to slot in.  

But with a few moments where I failed to move up, and one where I backed off seeing Tony Taylor starting to slide in turn 1 (held it), I lost my good position.  Coming into turn three on the last lap, I felt like I was ahead of trouble, but behind the money.  Sprinted out of turn 4, but behind the paying places, with only Euri Madera coming around me. 

31st.

A German won, with the first local rider Scott Savory in fifth place.

Just looked at my data.  Average speed was 29.2mph for 46 minutes.
A lap is .75mi.
The slowest was the first lap. 1:43 or 26.3mph.
In the final 10 laps, only one averaged below 29mph.
The fastest was the last, 1:26 or 31.5mph sprinting up to 35.2.

Not the performance I wanted.  But I'm happy to feel my body finally coming around.

Seriously this race should get as much fan fare and sponsors as Red Hook.

Murmurmurmirmur

Oops, doesn't take place in a borough that starts with a B and ends with a -rooklyn, so nah, there's no co-opting of cool here to be had.  Carry on.

Also JFC, reduce the cat 5 race fee.