It should also be noted that all Spooky road framesets ship (well, if and when they ship) with Cane Creek IS-3 headsets.

Norm is there another Spooky shipment? I'm assuming this is for the Hovac Staff's? I may take them up on the trade in offer. I loves my Skeletor but she handles like a bumble bee in a jar...I have to always be on guard. It slices and dices but don't go to sleep on her or you may end up face down like Jens Voight. Yacks

The deal is technically still available for you (the rest of the original Spooky 5). Although Mickey has shipped out a few HavocStaffs, he is apparently not pleased with some of the HS frames coming arriving from SAPA manufacturing in Portland, so he's having them re-tune some things. Thus, James is still waiting for his HavocStaff. I bailed on the HavocStaff and just got another Skeletor in a larger size.

But, I must say that I can't imagine how the HavocStaff will be any more supple in its ride characteristics... I mean it's actually a beefed-up Skeletor. I don't think the geometry adjustments are going to persuade those Enterprise-class Alu tubes to ease-up on the stiff-ifity factors.

NOTE: If you really want to get in on the trade-in, then I'm gonna pass the Spooky Dispatch Liaison job to you... dealing with Mickey is like doing business with Bart Simpson Bicycles Co. I can't take it anymore. He's well-meaning and all, and I like what he's trying to do, but it's really painful to cover all the fuck-ups to date. And the stellar no-contact policy doesn't endear me to him either. Perhaps you will have better success --you know, that warm, tube-amp TV narrator voice you've got, well, maybe Bart will respond to it...

-Norm

p.s. Skeletor has commandeered this wimpy Cervelo Warranty thread.

lol

bart simpson bicycle co.

i looked at his website today - the "rant" page about how they build their bikes in america because it is the only ethical thing to do considering the human rights abuses taking place in bicycle factories over in taiwan . . . that made me decide to never buy a single thing from him. not cause it's wrong, but because it was so incredibly self-righteous and out of place

if he had the communication skills to deal with overseas production management, he would probably be outsourcing to asia.

i bet some manager in china named Xiao Xio told him bart simpson would be a better businessman than him

ZING!

Speaking of "Manufactured by Simpson" my lovely new Van Dessel developed a MONSTER creak after one quick ride in the rain. I took apart the bottom bracket, cleaned & re-greased everything with Phil's but the creak is sill there, just smaller.

So my question is this - on my old SRAM (english) the "drive shaft" that connected the left & right cranks fit inside a sleeve - does BB30 not have this sleeve? When I took mine apart there just seemed to be two sets of bearings - one on each side with a huge "amphitheater" of frame betwixt them.

Is it conceivable that Edwin assembled a bike and forgot most of the bottom bracket? I'd post a picture but that would bean taking it all apart again...

j

I heard the Havoc Staff was supposed to be a bit slower handling...not as twitchy. But the geometry is a bit weird and I think I'm between sizes in the HS. Norm I'm glad to hear you got a bigger one...because I just could not see how the 2 of us could ride the same size frame. Mine fits really well albeit I could use a professional fit. That could eliminate my twitcy handling issues. I respectfuly decline the position of....oooo Notre Dame fumble!!!!!!....sorry, team liason to Spooky. I know Mickey is a bit touched. But I find him charming, in a labotomized teddy bear sort of way. Norm, you should get combat pay for your service! William, the made in USA rant doens't change the fact that the bikes are made in USA, which I likey.

Yacks

a "made in the USA" rant is pretty different from a "not made in the 3rd world" rant

i would find his marketing message more palatable if it focused on the "pro's" of building in the USA rather than the "con's" of building overseas

the header is titled "why our bikes cost so much"

maybe he should talk about craftsmanship or "local soul" or contributing to our GDP

talking instead about why other methods suck doesn't do much to detract from my perception of Spooky as being an over-priced aluminum frame that can be had cheaper and as good from elsewhere

-caad9 owner

and your caad9 was made where? It ain't overpriced when you factor in the retail cost of those Enve forks and Cane Creek headsets. The craftsmanship is good. Especially when compared to that heinous Van Dessel girder you used to ride. I give Mickey a pass on his rants. He has no public relations officer to tackle him and force a sock in his mouth. :)

@WDC yeah, the tone and all the non-sense he tosses-off about in his posts... eh, that's Mickey's signature cat5 philosophical sprint. Like Yacks, I appreciate his effort to add to the flicker that is American manufacturing, but his terrible sense of business and punkster reasoning will likely do more harm than good. According to Mickey, his manufacturer (SAPA) are just compulsively sorry with deadlines and can't get simple stuff right. Made in USA don't mean shit if it's shit that's made. Craig Gaulzetti is hoisting-up a much nicer US bicycle manufacturing operation --yes, much pricier bikes, but from what I gather, they are more pro on the business end.

@Yacks, I find the handling of the Skeletor to be non-twitchy, just very intuitive (you've seen how Bart Simpson rides rails on his skateboard right? that's the feeling). I was cruising no-hands very comfy today while fiddling with the Chinese zipper on my Chinese Kissena vest, and Skeletor was well behaved. Really, the only hard-to-handle aspect is hitting bumps and holes on high-speed descents... the rear-wheel will jump off its line in a feisty way. Now that I've written that, I'll reckon I'll do a face-plant in the park tomorrow. Anyhow, save-up and get a Gaulzetti Corsa, stiff and beautiful handling... that's what they say anyhow.

@Jules I think it's your pedal, not the crank. Remove the pedals, clean the pedal threads and the crank arm threads, grease well, and snug 'em up. If that doesn't work, Keith has some tips on BB anti-squeak methods.

@Jules - BB30 has no tube - nothing between the bearings!!!
BB30 can crap out pretty quickly.

Gaulzetti...$2800 for frame alone! That kind of pricing makes me want to buy a frame from a Chinese factory, with no pollution filters...manned by one armed children !

@yacks: i remember your bianchi had a very short stem. when it's disproportionately short (a relative term) it can make the handling tricky. if your spooky is set up the same, maybe try something a bit longer.

also, try bigger tires - might not make it handle better, but it will feel better. my 25's are the jam.

Ahhhs...I just put 25 Vittorias on today! The Spooky is devine with the carbon tubulars on her. I am working on the fit...

Road stems; easton or 3t?
I love my old easton but (ALAS) it's white and will clash with my new (and yet un-named) road bike...
j

I vote 3t...Neuvation has wicked cheap stems if you are not a brand whore

Oh the Neuvation carbon tubulars seem to be on sale again...if u r in the market for race wheels I highly recommend

<blockquote><cite>Posted By: Jeff Owens</cite>That guy's an idiot AND his blog is stupid. However, there is some "illusion of safety" that people have about helmets (and airport security, etc.). I often don't wear one. Oh no, don't start the helmet debate, Stephane!!!!!</blockquote>

wow...not a single american city in the top 20 "livable cities"

OK. No worries.

Sorry, this was meant for Jules...

What's afoot with midsole cleat positioning?

Nathaniel posted a link to a Joe Friel article on nutrition. I read the article then surfed over to Joe's blog and set foot on a post about midsole cleat positioning. Here's how Joe sums-up his view: "Should you try it? I've suggested to all of the athletes I coach that they move their cleats back toward the heels as far as they can. All that have tried it reported feeling more powerful."

Joe seems to recommend positioning the cleat exactly midsole, whereas the guy he seems to defer to on the topic (Steve Hogg) seems to recommend a position that's behind the ball of the foot but not as far back as Joe seems to prefer. If any of our more research-oriented members have experience with more experimental cleat positioning, I like to get the scoop on this...

Here's the Friel blog post:
http://www.trainingbible.com/joesblog/2007/01/cleat-position.html

Here's the Hogg post:
http://www.stevehoggbikefitting.com/blog/2011/04/power-to-the-pedal-cleat-position/

I read into this a couple of years ago and there is a lot of material out there - some of which is just debunking KOPS, but a lot of stuff from Steve H is more constructive.

I don't recall the physics/bio-mechanics of it all, but the principle of it is that a mid-sole cleat keeps the foot in a more solid position since you won't be moving your heel up and down as much. This enables you to generate more power.

For a weekend endurance rider, Tri-geek or TT specialist the mid-foot position may be the best option. However it's much harder to accelerate hard and sprinting is severely compromised so it's not suitable for road racers.

However a compromise is a cleat position that is more rearward than KOPS. 10mm for a size 44, but it's a sliding scale. This alows more power to be generated as more of the foot is over the pedal, but it doesn't hamper sprinting (too much), etc.

About 3 years ago I moved my cleats back as far as they would go - which was about 6mm in Diadora shoes - and I noticed a small improvement in power - or at least what I perceived to be power. Bascially I felt a bit more solid in the pedal stroke.
Then 18 months ago I went to see Bill Peterson for a proper foot fitting gig, and this resulted in a change of shoes to shimano, and my cleats can now be 10mm back, and this felt better again (but that was probably the orthotics he built).

The only downside I have is foot overlap. This is not an issue when riding, but I am always getting black tire marks on the front of my shoes when stopped and clipped in and track stands at lights can easily turn into embarassing face plants.

If you try this - you do need to lower your saddle a good few mm, which could be a PITA if you have an ISP.

In the gym and with squatting, the dogma is that your knee should in an ideal world be directly above your ankle (that is to say, the shin is perpendicular to the floor and the knee makes a right angle with your thigh parallel to the ground). This is a tricky position so it is also 'accepted' for a little bit of knee movement to help balance the bar on your shoulders. Hence, it's OK to have your knee directly above your toes (but no further at all) such that the shin is not totally perpendicular to the floor, and the bent knee, now at an angle less than 90 degrees, still leaves your femur about parallel to the ground. This is 'correct' technique for this move. The arguing with this is that it puts a lot of stress on the knee to do this move in another alignment (which is very true if you ever try it).

As a result, I've always sort of carried this mantra onto the bike, in that I try to keep my knee about directly above the ankle at the most force-applying part of the stroke (i.e. when the pedal is horizontal). Not sure it this is right or not. All I know is that I know it hurts your knees to do squats wrong. I have never had knee issues on a bike. This is comfortable to me. Of course, weights are not the same as cycling.

I say this as I assume cleat position is integral to knee position and hence stress on the joint.

I find that by keeping my shin parallel to the floor, whilst bending at the midsection it is much easier to maintain a balance during a maximal eccentric contraction. Some people recommend keeping the outer thigh directly in line with the the angle of the major metatarsals while bending but I've never been able to do this without compromising my core adduction.

Either way, be sure to breathe fully at the bottom of the power cycle, so that your diaphragm is properly aligned with the ossicles... and for god's sake, don't forget to squint.

Nashbar is selling the Yksion Comp Kevlar tire for $44.99.

Does anybody know if this is the same tire as the Yksion Comp kevlar K10? (on the picture, no mention of K10 on tire, just COMP and kevlar).

Bringing this thread back from the dead!!

I've got it into my head that I am going to get a bike fit. Having looked around, I am aware that I will be spending $250-350 for the service so am prepared.

I at present don't have any pain issues when I ride (no knee ache, back aches, itchy finger nails etc.) so am simply looking to go to someone who is racing knowledgable. I understand that lots of people want to use cycling as a good way to keep fit and want to be very comfortable when riding. I am personally looking for the most efficient position possible in a racing scenario. Is there a fitter who kind of specialises in this that anyone knows of? Of course, I may have some problems (probably) with my style which I am unaware of which might need attention too.

I looked into the Serotta system in their base upstate. I emailed for info as it seems very thorough but they are in the process of moving site and openly wrote on their site that at present they are not really able to get back to people who sent email correspondence. Hence, would like to think of some alternatives.

So, to make this easy for people to respond to:

1)If you personally (not your friend's friend) have had a fit, what are your thoughts on the improvement in performance of the service you received?

2)How did you deal with your several bikes? I have a 'racing' and 'training' bike and want the same fit for both. I assume that's covered under one fee?

3)Is there a club consensus, or, can we get a fitter on our jersey and get discounts??

Thanks for your input, again! I appreciate the same questions are asked every year over and over, I guess it's a good sign that new people are getting into the club.

Adam-

I've copied below my post from last May about my experience with Mike Sherry (Performance Labs HC) in response to a similar question from Eric M:

"I was fit by Craig Upton about 5-6 years ago and then re-fit on a new bike by his partner Mike Sherry within the last 6 months. In both cases I've been very happy with the results. As JP suggests, choosing a fitter is bit like choosing a religion, you either have to have some feeling that the system upon which they base their suggestions makes sense or have blind unchallenging faith. While Craig/Mike are clearly adherents of the Wobble Naught philosophy, I've found them to be less parochial in practice than in theory...in other words they will help you in making the changes they recommend incrementally and/or will spend time with little tweaks"

Adam-To address some of your specific questions:

I'm not able to quantify the improvement on performance, nor have I ever really tried to so. I did simply "feel better" on the bike post fit and the changes were fairly radical from my prior position.

I don't know how Mike works with multiple bikes with the same purpose. He may address that question on the website somewhere....
http://www.performancelabshc.com/pages.php?id=55

My guess (and it's only a guess) is that If bike 2 is not the same frame in the same size as bike 1, with the same stem bars, cranks, saddle, etc. (and therefore not precisely the same geometry) then he would have to accurately measure bike #2, set it up, and then work with you on it for a bit, so there's still a decent amount of work to be done. My guess (and it's only a guess) is that if you do it as part of the same session, he might charge additional for bike 2, but probably not double the basic fee. That having been said, he did charge me the basic fee all over again when I went to get myself fit on a TT bike after having been fit on a road bike--but I understand that. Also, you come out of there with an annotated diagram (as I assume you do with most fitters), so in theory you could take that home and apply the dimensions yourself to bike 2. I personally don't have the patience, accuracy, or skill to do that well however so I'd probably have the fotter do it.

Also, look up the the prior discussions of the do-it-yourself Fit Stick solution, which I know many people feel is very helpful (and certainly an inexpensive way to go). If nothing else you may be able to use it to carry over the dimensions from bike 1 to bike 2 once you have someone else fit you. I'm sure JP and others can answer that.

Good luck.

OK about to take this guy into a bike shop if I can't figure it out.

I am installing a new shifting cable on my cross bike. For the rear derailleur. Can't figure out how to route it through the shifter. Done lots of internet searching and reading and can't seem to get it.

Any tips?

edit: it is sram rival.

Posted By: mperlbergOK about to take this guy into a bike shop if I can't figure it out.

I am installing a new shifting cable on my cross bike. For the rear derailleur. Can't figure out how to route it through the shifter. Done lots of internet searching and reading and can't seem to get it.

Any tips?

edit: it is sram rival.

peel back hood, under where your thumb would rest, you should see a cover with some holes and a couple of screws. you dont have to remove the cover. you should see the white racheting cam under, that's where the cable feeds through. make sure it's clicked down all the way. should be able to feed fairly easily after that.

you can thread the cable through the shifter backwards and see where it comes out

Hmm. So I Ragot and I spent a ton of time trying to get a cable through and had no luck whatsoever. We'd get it in the correct hole but it would get stuck.

Went to ride Brooklyn, and the mech slid the cable right through. WTF. It wasn't the same cable we were using, so I'm wondering if that was the difference. I'm tempted to take it out and try again to see, but don't want to pretty my luck so I will be happy to have a cable in there.

Mike