With 14 registered riders I think we have room for 3 distinct plans:

1) Final sprint/yellow Christian
2) Dan green jersey and the tito/condon for KOM
3) late moves and counter Dave/Jules/Ryan

Frankly if Tito wants a late move and or counter we could make life hell for the pack with consecutive two-man moves between me, Dave, Ryan and Tito.

I would really like to get a warmup lap in so that would be the best place to chat and plan; there just never seems to be time otherwise.

Warmup lap, no excuses. If we can't even meet early enough to give a race briefing, how can we expect to get the real stuff done in combat?

I drive in from the northern Nassau/Suffolk border you know - that alarm goes off at 3:50.


Let's get it done.

Tito, there's no reason why you can't look to be a late attacker. If you want to do it, you should.

Dan had you slotted to contest the KOM, though.

Are you thinking you want to do both?



Side note: As Tito just did, ya gotta speak up, fellers! I'm a big believer that we should always try to create our plans to enable people's goals and aspirations, not prioritize ideal race planning at the expense of them. Personally, I ENJOY being domestique sometimes. But I also like being protected in races that suit me!

Now, if Christian starts telling us he wants support to help him win Tour of the Catskills, or if I start telling you guys I want a lead out train so I can unleash my finishing sprint, we may nudge things in another direction. But speak up! We should all be helpers sometimes, and we should also all have the chance to succeed.

My goal is to get into the winning move and then to win.

If that doesn't work, I'm gaining some confidence in the finale and will come help with lead-out efforts or freelance my way to the finish if we don't have numbers.

The field looks interesting. One rider to certainly keep an eye on is Augusto Sanchez of Mengoni, he was ridiculously strong all year last year, in breaks and in the sprint. This is the first time I have seen him this season.

The rest of mengoni are sprinters except Bunde, who hasn't been all that strong this year.

That Team Sommerville has representation and they can be really strong or really annoying, depending on their mood.

Dioslaki is always good for a break. The WS Untied crew has anthony lowe + 3 burrowes brothers, so we can keep an eye on them, but nobody seems to be lighting it up from their crew just yet.

Anything else we are missing?

@ Ryan - basically I was thinking in terms of a pre-second-KOM-lap attack, which would result in either a successful breakaway or a shot at the KOM if after the lap the field closes in before the hill. This is kind of ideal-world thinking which I know doesn't always play out, but that was my thought.

What time do we want to meet for a warmup?

Posted By: tito@ Ryan - basically I was thinking in terms of a pre-second-KOM-lap attack, which would result in either a successful breakaway or a shot at the KOM if after the lap the field closes in before the hill. This is kind of ideal-world thinking which I know doesn't always play out, but that was my thought.

What time do we want to meet for a warmup?

Aha. If you think that's your best chance at KOM then it seems to me that works well for the rest of the plan, because if/when you're brought back after you take the KOM, the post-KOM attackers are set up quite nicely.

My vote would be a 545 meeting at the bathrooms so we can meet while pinning on numbers. But that's just me.....

My goal is to get into the winning break, and failing that, to help get John to the sprint

I'm going to come right out and say: I am not interested in killing myself in the first half of the race. Every time that I do that, I lack the pop when moves go at the end. I'd like to stay chill for the first 6-7 laps, then follow/counterattack after one of the sprints or KOM's.



Standing Order For The Sprint: If we haven't connected already, on the last lap, meet at the front of the pack on the right side of the road by the bandshell on the west side of the park.

Great...so the dudes I already know on the bike well respond...

Damn the mystery men on our team! Probably working, volunteering for the homeless instead of responding to my requests.

Let me dovetail a few comments in here too...

Perlberg is on target with his observation. WS United is traditionally pretty weak in the early parts of the season. If you get in a break with them, you can count on them sending at least one guy up to help block. But if you are in that break, don't expect monster pulls. Of course they are always a threat in the final sprint, but won't bother with a leadout. They'll freelance it off the 5 or 6 other "pure" sprinters of our parks.

Mengoni is a tricky team to figure out sometimes. They actually ride pretty terribly as a unified team, but they've got a mix of strong breakaway and strong sprint riders who disguise their team's overall general stink. Pollo senior and Wilson will sit back and wait for the sprint and will not, under any circumstances put their nose in the wind, unless they think they can bridge solo. Pollo Jr has been getting in the mix for breakaways. Bunde while contemplating what would have been if he never got caught doping, will definitely actively block for his teammates in a breakaway. But with Brian Breech apparently not racing, as their main and most reliable breakaway threat, I don't actually expect them to be useful for anything.

Guillame Nellesen of Van Dessel is kind of a Van "Diesel." He's tall and not hard to pick out, and can be counted on for some good legs for the breakaway...and dangerous in the sprint. He's a track racer.

But more than what the other teams are going to be doing, I'm more concerned with what our team is going to be doing. Of the people who haven't checked in, I've raced a ton with Strika and Stokes. I expect they'll both be strong and there or there-abouts for breakaway blocking riding.

Vlad, Katz, Joaquin, Rene? What's up? Where you at broheims?

Ragot here. What would you like me to say?
I race as hard as my legs will let me. This should be a better week than last - less fatigue and more sleep.

I want to be in the winning break with Mike or WDC and then win from that break.

Failing that, I plan to have more go go juice in my legs to help lead out at the end.

Check out...

Lt Dan, stepping in right now to try to articulate the strategy for 4/28 race, and summarize all your thoughts. I have a spreadsheet that I wish I could show you all here. (It is all our names lined up under 3 colors red, green & yellow, and I feel like I should be sending this out at 4:20 or something).

3 teams, supporting each of our goals, Win, KOM & Sprint.
KOM Team (Red) :
Eric Mehlenbeck
Jeff Condon
Matthew Arlyck (Tito)
Chris Bloome
Jeffrey White
So your protected riders here are Jeff and Tito. On the KOM laps you all should be looking to move Tito and Jeff to the front and prepare to get them 2/3 to 3/4 of the way up the hill before letting them unleash a 30 second sprint. The goal is to be controlling the front from the base of the hill to the point where the road has a pull-out spot on the left side, and unleash the protected riders.

Sprint Team (Green):
Chris Yack
Christopher Conde
James Nelson
Daniel Reiners
David Stearns
Chris and I will be the protected riders in this. Chris will be going for his 1K out attack, while I get a leadout from the rest of you guys and we take as many points as we can for the Sprint. Remember, your job isn't done when the sprint points are over. We have to be ready to line up for Christian for the final sprint, and controlling the front.


Win Team (Yellow):
Ryan Johnston
David Vollbach
Jules Roazen
Christian Refakis
Around laps 5 or 6 David goes for a late attack wearing yellow. When the field freaks out and chases him down, Ryan and Jules go for a two-up killer Kissena attack. Hopefully either nobody has legs to go with it, or Jules and Ryan rip their legs off in the last lap with alternating attacks and come in 1&2. The rest of us prepare to line up with a fresh Christian gunning for the field sprint win. If we do it right we go 1,2,3, and we have enough muffin money to make it rain muffins.

I like the finale plan...it makes sense. Yes, the sprinters may crap their bibs and chase the Vol's. The counters by Jules and Ryan makes sense. In the few spring series races I did in the masters, I noticed a strategy that Axis employed to get their riders off the front. They had small trains of 2-3 riders. The 1st guys would go off like a rocket and shell himself to get the other 1-2 riders clear of the field. After five or six of these, something would always stick. I think late in the race, Jules and Ryan should find one Kissena guy who is willing to detonate to get those two off the front together.
There is always the hill. Drafting is not as big a factor, so dropping the hammer there is always a good way to break something off. If it doesn't work you will have softened up the sprinters for the finale. that's all I gots...oh and it looks like it will be in the 30's in the a.m. lovely.

Dan, I will drop Thor's hammer at 1k....if that's what you want.
Yacks

While I understand the idea of ryan and tools together, I think

Sent from my phone so please disregard the spelling mistakes that their size discrepancies could create a problem.

545? Sure.

Bathrooms 5:45 for some discussion.

On Fri, Apr 27, 2012 at 4:29 PM, Charlie Issendorf wrote:

All,



I still do not know how to use our forum. Can somebody this for me:



Registration volunteers are needed for tomorrow’s race. If you volunteer you race for free. Please email Charlie I. at cibike@aol.com


Also, if somebody would like to volunteer to be a marshal at the narrow section at the bottom of the hill please let me know. I will have 2 marshals there but I like to have a Kissena member present there as well to make sure the marshals are doing their job and everything is safe. I started this at least week’s race and it worked out well.



Charlie Issendorf

Race Director

Kissena Cycling Club

To state the obvious:


Pinning up at the bathrooms at 5:45 means you're registering at 5:30.


Gentlemen, I look forward to racing beside you. GYMKATAAA!!!

Posted By: eragotWhile I understand the idea of ryan and tools together, I think

Sent from my phone so please disregard the spelling mistakes that their size discrepancies could create a problem.

Thanks for the clearly stated advice, coach.

Rock it tomorrow dudes.

Your plan looks fucking delicious.

Rags man, we gotta at least pretend to plan and talk about the race...if it was just the 4 or 5 of us that race each other a lot, than no biggy about pre-race chatter...but we've got a lot of "new" guys to wrangle here.

Okay gents...I'm going to do my best to get there early so we can light some fire under each other for the race, and wrangle the forum silent members of our team tomorrow. Work and family crap is keeping me from racing for the next month or so, so I'd like to help make this a good showing for the team. So if I'm tardy and we don't get to chat before hand...

Ragot, WDC, Perlberg go for breaks as usual. If my legs are good, then I'll keep an eye on the early junky stuff. If, for example I actually get away with someone early, then I will either sit on or work with them to stay away. Give the field someone to chase while you guys keep the powder dry. However, I know that I got nothing on nobody, soooo....no active blocking for me (but don't chase me down, you know, "fly casual") but look for counters up to me, or get ready to counter as I get spit off of the back of whatever move I'm in.

If my legs are totally for shit, I'm going to try and do 1 or 2 high-value things for the team (i.e. help close down a dangerous split, help lead out Malcolmson, etc.) but that will probably be it. So, for example if you want me to bring you to the front during a fast or windy stretch, know that I can probably do it, but it might be my last effort before getting dropped by the field. So ask wisely of this weak one.

If we've got say 5 guys at the end near the front, we gotta try a leadout. My preference is to be in position leading into the downhill, but coming out of the narrow left handed sweeper, is a place to move up in a hurry if the field isn't already strung out. The outside line, on the right side is fast and will slingshot you around the nervous nellies braking on the inside line. Shoot to the front and start to ramp it up. Malcolmson, it's going to be your responsibility to be near the front, and close enough to the action to find our wheels. Leadout men, just get to the front and do your thing. No looking behind you. It's the sprinter's responsibility to make sure he's on the right wheels.

During the leadout, when you feel the guys creeping up on either side of you, tighten the screws a little harder. No jumps here, just pour on the watts to literally and figuratively get them back in line. As you die for real though, the next Kissena takes over. No 500 meter jumps please...keep it steady and fast. 400-500 watts for a minute or so or whatever you got. At some point (hopefully around 200 or less) all hell will break loose, then the final leadout guy sprints with John on his wheel like he's going for the glory himself.

No crazy swinging off after your leadout pull. You won't need to. Guys will come around you and if we've done it right, it will be another Kissena.

high 41 low of 19, no time to f around clothing wise.

Just FYI.

word

MOST IMPORT PART: as Marc says, lead-out train meets on the RIGHT side of the road BEFORE we start the downhill. get to the front, get on the right, and start calling out for KISSENA!!!! seriously . . . yell. it works.

Yes...I gots my gloves, leg warmers and heavish long sleeve base jersey...dress warm tomorrow

I'm in.

Can I be on "Team Cool"? I have pink bar tape. I'm an army of one.

I'm here to vomit and kill. Which means, sit in....

Tip for cold racing: don't wear the jersey you're going to race in TO the race. Put it in your bag and be toasty warm in your winter gear as you pin up.

Wait a sec...

Posted By: Christian Refakishigh 41 low of 19, no time to f around clothing wise.

Just FYI.

There aint no low of 19 degrees! You had me worried.

Marc -

I'll be helping with Reg, I'll check in with all 123 riders and let everyone know what is up.

good luck 4's...sounds good. &123's too!

did you guys win?!?!?!

^ Drunk posting!

Good thing Joe isn't defending the KOM otherwise, we'd have to ride alongside him to keep him straight@!