Jul 07, 2012 at 02:36 PM
Given Schleck's waffling about really "wanting" the top seed spot I suspect that with Horner, Kodi & Cancellara free of the trouble they just decided to leave him for dead. Metaphorically speaking.
Tour de France 2012
Jul 07, 2012 at 05:37 PM
I'm trying to figure out what possessed me to to take Brice Feillu instead of TJV.
(^^Oops, wrong thread.)
Jul 07, 2012 at 06:19 PM
Anyone else here think team Sky's ride in the mtns. today was on the suspicious side?
Jul 07, 2012 at 06:46 PM
Kinda like the doctor from Lotto moving to Quickstep and Boonen having a Gilbert-like early season, including a Roubaix performance unlike anything he's done in the past (soloing for 40+ k, ala Cancellara). Oh, the same doctor that was on Saunier Duval and Festina? Hmmm.....
I dunno, all those guys rode until they blew except Froome. Who's almost a second coming of the chicken in skinniness.
I dunno, all those guys rode until they blew except Froome. Who's almost a second coming of the chicken in skinniness.
Jul 07, 2012 at 06:56 PM
Jules,
I think that most teammates know when and how to discount what they read in the press. Schleck was the leader and he's been teammates with Cancellara and Voigt for years--I'm sure they know Frank well enough to know when to discount such talk. Horner is usually the loyal soldier--unless he thinks he can win. Kloden is likewise a team player. What's interesting is how Zubeldia and Monfort are in the top 10 now. And Popovich, another team player, was the only one back with Schleck.
Yack,
Maybe this came up earlier in the year, back when Wiggins got most of the Tour guys to come with him to Tenerife.
And I still wonder why Froome wasn't seen as a favorite. He got second at the Vuelta working for Wiggins. Beat him in a 47km TT by almost 30 seconds as well.
Jul 07, 2012 at 06:57 PM
Anyone else here think team Sky's ride in the mtns. today was on the suspicious side?I mean...for Froome to be able to do what he did on domestique duty and then without a break counter Evans and take the win easily was pretty darn superhuman.
Jul 07, 2012 at 07:05 PM
Froome is awesome. He seems to race with a lot of heart. He first caught my attention desperately trying to stay ahead of the field a couple of years ago while riding up the Cauberg at the end of Amstel Gold (or maybe it was the Mur at the end of Fleche Wallone, in any case, he didn't manage).
But "the chicken" was Rasmussen I believe. He came to a bad end, like so many others.
But "the chicken" was Rasmussen I believe. He came to a bad end, like so many others.
Jul 07, 2012 at 07:55 PM
Froome only took over at 2k, so it might not be that suspicious when you think of what they usually have to do.
Jul 07, 2012 at 09:21 PM
Froome not Wiggo could be the biggest poker hand we've seen in a long time...
Jul 07, 2012 at 09:21 PM
that last pitch looked brutal after the climb they had just completed - freakish ride by froome. when evans went, did he just go too early, or was that a defensive measure since he was by himself?
Jul 07, 2012 at 10:43 PM
that last pitch looked brutal after the climb they had just completed - freakish ride by froome. when evans went, did he just go too early, or was that a defensive measure since he was by himself?I think he was just trying to go early enough that he could separate from Wiggins and gain a few seconds.
Jul 08, 2012 at 12:04 AM
This poor bastard is a mess after that crash:
Jul 08, 2012 at 12:28 AM
some great photos from the tour...
down the thread here is a link to the picture that Euskatel's Gorka Verdugo tweeted of his injured leg (not for the squeamish)..... http://www.cyclingtips.com.au/2012/07/chasing-the-tour-stage-6-gc-blown-to-bits/
and today's big stage: http://www.cyclingtips.com.au/2012/07/chasing-the-tour-stage-7-where-will-cadel-make-his-time-on-wiggins/ where you can see that peter sagan is so strong he climbed the last 300m doing a wheelie...
Jul 08, 2012 at 02:06 AM
I showed that picture to Lisa and her response was, "That needs a Power Wash and some stitching."
Jul 08, 2012 at 02:42 AM
Jul 08, 2012 at 01:38 PM
Klöden, the quiet man of cycling seems to love the twitter for expressing himself. Good for us, not sure how good it is for his career though:
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/kloden-on-the-defensive-with-radioshack-twitter-offensive
The irony here, is that the last time he shot off his mouth on Twitter, was to criticize Horner for having the audacity to think he could ride the tour without racing x or y races. Horner, (in)famous for "telling like it is," responds with Leipheimer/Hincapie like professionalism (and yet managed not to put me to sleep the minute he opened his mouth; maybe it was because after he said something to the effect of, 'we're all pros here, we've got a job to do, there's no problem, it's just like an office, you aren't best friends with every cubicle, but that doesn't stop you from doing your job.' A statement which strikes me as very true, and also lets us know that he and Klodi aren't going for beers and burgers in matching lederhosen after this tour is over).
What I'm unclear about however, at this point, is did Chris have the legs to finish closer to the front? Was he being the loyal lieutenant when he finished with the Klöden group? I guess time will tell.
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/kloden-on-the-defensive-with-radioshack-twitter-offensive
The irony here, is that the last time he shot off his mouth on Twitter, was to criticize Horner for having the audacity to think he could ride the tour without racing x or y races. Horner, (in)famous for "telling like it is," responds with Leipheimer/Hincapie like professionalism (and yet managed not to put me to sleep the minute he opened his mouth; maybe it was because after he said something to the effect of, 'we're all pros here, we've got a job to do, there's no problem, it's just like an office, you aren't best friends with every cubicle, but that doesn't stop you from doing your job.' A statement which strikes me as very true, and also lets us know that he and Klodi aren't going for beers and burgers in matching lederhosen after this tour is over).
What I'm unclear about however, at this point, is did Chris have the legs to finish closer to the front? Was he being the loyal lieutenant when he finished with the Klöden group? I guess time will tell.
Jul 08, 2012 at 01:50 PM
Don't know if it made the press but Horner tweeted last night that he flatted with 20k to go. Could explain his result on the final climb.
Jul 08, 2012 at 07:06 PM
Apparently Wiggo feels the Armsrong tactic is the winning one, when asked about people who still think cycling has a doping problem:
“Honestly they’re just fucking wankers. I can’t be doing with people like that,” Wiggins said. “It justifies their own bone idleness… because they can’t ever imagine applying themselves to anything in their lives.
Yeah, he's right. 'Cause cycling has been soooo clean for the last, oh 100 years? He's right, how DARE anyone assume that doping isn't banished. Yup, all of us BONE IDLE WANKERS who have never applied ourselves are WAY out of line...
Nothing like the old ad-hominem attacks to make your point. Good show Wiggo, all class.
Jul 08, 2012 at 07:49 PM
Without wishing to appear like a jingoistic, Team Sky-loving uber-patriot Brit (I'm far from it), Brad and co would have to have gone utterly insane to have gone down the doping route and I dislike the innuendo suggesting otherwise just off the back of a few good results. I know, what with Lance and everything, we can no longer believe anything anyone says ever and that almost any great racing feat will probably met with a "yeah, but was he...?", BUT Team Sky is ultimately a product of, and inexorably linked to, Team GB, i.e. Wiggins, Thomas, Cavendish etc. were all products of the success of GB's track program, while with David Brailsford and Shane Sutton, you have the same management.
GB's track program was entirely linked to national funding and as a result, would have to be, and was, clean. If a single British Sky rider was ever found to have doped, it would potentially bring down the entire Team GB - i.e. no more lottery money, no more medals etc. For Wiggins to be doping, he would presumably have to have the go-ahead from Brailsford (who continues to be head of Team GB btw). Otherwise Brailsford would ask "what's with the better results, Bradley?". Brailsford would never allow it to happen - on ethical grounds (yes, them) but also for the very rational reasons laid out above. No Tour de France win would be worth being hanged, drawn and quartered in the UK, let alone destroying a country's awe-inspiring national cycling program.
These aren't some crook Euro doctors coming up with a conspiracy involving code names, blood bags and seedy motorway motels to give riders an edge, I think it's an edge that comes from the application of incredible professionalism on all fronts ("marginal gains" being a good example - a philosophy first perfected by Team GB on the track and carried over to Team Sky) that only a lot of money and top class management can bring. I may be wrong, but that's what I think.
One great day in the mountains, clearly planned very well and executed likewise by riders at the top of their game, does not a doping conspiracy make. I would only start getting suspicious when we see Cav winning a mountain stage a la Hincapie...
GB's track program was entirely linked to national funding and as a result, would have to be, and was, clean. If a single British Sky rider was ever found to have doped, it would potentially bring down the entire Team GB - i.e. no more lottery money, no more medals etc. For Wiggins to be doping, he would presumably have to have the go-ahead from Brailsford (who continues to be head of Team GB btw). Otherwise Brailsford would ask "what's with the better results, Bradley?". Brailsford would never allow it to happen - on ethical grounds (yes, them) but also for the very rational reasons laid out above. No Tour de France win would be worth being hanged, drawn and quartered in the UK, let alone destroying a country's awe-inspiring national cycling program.
These aren't some crook Euro doctors coming up with a conspiracy involving code names, blood bags and seedy motorway motels to give riders an edge, I think it's an edge that comes from the application of incredible professionalism on all fronts ("marginal gains" being a good example - a philosophy first perfected by Team GB on the track and carried over to Team Sky) that only a lot of money and top class management can bring. I may be wrong, but that's what I think.
One great day in the mountains, clearly planned very well and executed likewise by riders at the top of their game, does not a doping conspiracy make. I would only start getting suspicious when we see Cav winning a mountain stage a la Hincapie...
Jul 08, 2012 at 08:34 PM
@ Kieran I don't pretend to know if Wiggo is juiced, but I think it's beyond the pale for anyone in the pro peloton to view skepticism with at much rancor. It is well earned, and bizarre that he would think otherwise.
Wiggo, Evans & co are sitting at the very start of an era of "cleaner" cycling and loyal fans (some who have been following cycling since before these guys were born) have seen a parade of "I'm shocked, shocked to find doping in this sport..." so it's not unreasonable to suspect the worst. It is not charitable either, but it's not wankish.
At this point the clean riders are the anomaly, not the norm. Skepticism is fair and GB may indeed be killing it with cleaner, better, more scientific practices. I certainly hope so.
Wiggo is entitled to be hurt, offended etc but he knew going into this that people would suspect all his performances, fair or not.
Jul 08, 2012 at 08:38 PM
Be that as it may.
After spending so many hours training and planning for the TdF, you would think they could spend just a little bit of effort planning for the inevitable QUESTION.
I agree with Jules . . . all class (not).
The TdF is more complex than most things.
After spending so many hours training and planning for the TdF, you would think they could spend just a little bit of effort planning for the inevitable QUESTION.
I agree with Jules . . . all class (not).
The TdF is more complex than most things.
Jul 09, 2012 at 01:33 AM
Total douche quote by Wiggo. Absurd.
Jul 09, 2012 at 02:40 AM
Kieran,
I take a dim view of ad hominem attacks. I have the feeling that the person making them, is doing so to distract us from the issue at hand. Which is what Wiggins seems to be trying to do. Throwing dirt on your critics doesn't make them look dirty. It makes you look childish.
Sadly, I think Wiggins has taken several cues from Armstrong. in 1999, Armstrong was self-righteous and angry about doping accusations at the Tour. He also made ad hominem attacks. It was also the same Tour in which he tested positive for cortisone and later produced a back-dated TUE. And subsequent tests indicate he had EPO in his blood that Tour as well.
Wiggins has also replicated Armstrong with the frequent trips to Tenerife. This is where Dr. Fuentes of Operacion Puerto fame currently lives. It's also where lots of dopers seemed to go to avoid being tested in training. And Wiggins has been making the claim that his training is so much harder than racing, something Armstrong claimed as well. And Armstrong also did the extensive camps thing. The claim that he's training harder must make him feel righteous. I find it ridiculous. There's no way to know who is actually training the hardest; even if there was, it wouldn't matter. Training smartest is more important. And that pales compared to racing better.
Your comment on team GB I find a bit hollow. This is the same group that relaxed their lifetime ban of convicted dopers just in time to secure Cav' the help of David Millar in London. High standards indeed.
And your comment about Hincapie is more apt that you might have thought. Hincapie was a prodigious talent. He stomped on everyone as a junior (back when he was on Kissena). Medaled in pursuit at junior worlds. Went to the Olympics his first year as a senior. To get better at the tour, he lost lots of weight, did extensive high altitude training camps. Just like Wiggins.
I'm not suggesting Wiggins is guilty of doping just by these associations. (Or that Hincapie is guilty by his associations.) I have no way of knowing if he's racing clean or not. But I am pointing them out to explicitly tell you that Wiggins has to know about these as well and both he and his team should have figured out how to deal.
To me, his whine this afternoon makes him a wanker.
Jul 09, 2012 at 01:57 PM
Good show these innovative new tires are making, I'm sure Tony Martin is loving them!
Jul 09, 2012 at 02:58 PM
Does anyone have a working video link today?
Jul 09, 2012 at 03:08 PM
Jul 09, 2012 at 03:09 PM
blocked
merde. thanks anyway
merde. thanks anyway
Jul 09, 2012 at 03:15 PM
Jul 09, 2012 at 03:30 PM
Weird, still working for me. Go to Steephill.
http://nyvelocity.com/content/features/2012/tour-day-schmalz-2012-stage-8-review
Man, Froome and Wiggins look, uh, well...out of this world, eh?
http://nyvelocity.com/content/features/2012/tour-day-schmalz-2012-stage-8-review
Man, Froome and Wiggins look, uh, well...out of this world, eh?
Jul 09, 2012 at 03:31 PM
Sigh.