Kissena Forum Archive

Verge Series (was Castelli Series)

1074 comments · 11661 views
I’m in for Saturday in Masters field. 

Charlie needs volunteers. He is good to the club, please help out.

https://tinyurl.com/kissenareg
I’m in for masters and some registration helping. 
I'm in as well.

I'd love to try something this Saturday.  Coordinated attacking. Considering we know there are going to be two KoM and two intermediate sprints, I'd love to try a move after the first set.  

If I remember correctly, there's first a KoM, then an intermediate.  If that's the case, I'd love, if it's all together before the sprint to move up toward the front, but behind the guys going for the sprint.  Have one or two people follow them through the sprint, then keep going.  And if and when that move is about to be brought back, have another person go.  And another.  And another.

We also should come up with a sprint strategy.  I don't think we have a good enough sprinter to preserve one person for the end, but we could make a call during the race and have a spot on the course where on the last lap we meet and proceed forward.  For example, the field is often on the right side of the road by the temple.  We could meet at the left side of the road in the top 15 and then have a line going up the left side.

thoughts?
Here is something I’ve noticed about sprinting in the local races - it’s  often a case of “I’ll try a bunch of things in the race and if none of that works out I’ll sprint.”

The reality is is that most amateur racers don’t have anything like that number of matches to burn. It’s agonizing waiting and waiting and waiting some more but if you want to be fresh enough to position yourself and then contest the sprint you’re gonna have to hide for the WHOLE race beforehand.
1000% agree with Jules. I intend to be invisible for 99% of the race and only pop up late in the game to provide a tiny motor to drag folks to the front and keeping it strung out as long as my old man legs will go. 
I’ll be in the Masters
So what's the plan?

Try to get Jeff or JP into a counter attack break after the second KOM?

Wait for the sprint?

expend a ton of energy on short efforts that don't get us anywhere?

I am willing to help out for whatever those goals are, I am just going to not worth much and I am happy to expend that energy to help somebody but I am also happy to make this a fast training ride too and just hang out until the finish. 100% at the disposal of the team and whomever is road captaining this week.
Signed up for marshal patroller, more volunteers needed at reg table for tomorrow's race
I'm happy to attack/counterattack after the first green jersey sprint to help JP get into a break
Jules said:
Here is something I’ve noticed about sprinting in the local races - it’s  often a case of “I’ll try a bunch of things in the race and if none of that works out I’ll sprint.”

The reality is is that most amateur racers don’t have anything like that number of matches to burn. It’s agonizing waiting and waiting and waiting some more but if you want to be fresh enough to position yourself and then contest the sprint you’re gonna have to hide for the WHOLE race beforehand.
Yes and no.  

Yes to a limited number of matches.  Yes, it can make a big difference in a sprint.  But most people don't ride the last lap as if they're actually going to sprint, and having teammates moving you up saves oodles of energy.

No we don't really have a sprinter who can win in the race.  

Still, as a team, there should always be a sprint strategy.  And the most important thing about sprinting is positioning.  Yes, people will burn matches, but for Prospect, if you can get up the hill in the top 15 or 10, you've got a pretty good shot at a placing, even if you're not explosive.  

And if you're not getting near cramping or throwing up the last time up the hill, you still have plenty of gas left.

  

I'm happy to attack/counterattack after the first green jersey sprint to help JP get into a break
I was going to offer to go first.  But I'm happy to go second or third.  

Jeff has also been riding well; love to have him on board and ready to go for one of them.  
I can work for either Jeff or JP in early attack/counterattack or to move them up for finishing sprint
Sorry, I posted this morning from my phone (I thought) but doesn't look like it went through. I'm happy to try something and having a plan going into it. I agree with the limited number of matches. I feel like chase the wrong breaks and when the one that sticks goes I've got nothing left. I personally would rather go on the hill on or off a KOM lap as it suits me better. Going after the green jersey sprint will be more difficult for me. That said I'll do whatever. I'd prefer to counter 2nd or 3rd if possible. 

Also I agree to having a final sprint plan and like the idea of lining up on the left at the temple. I can usually make my way up to the top 10 on the last hill (especially if I've been hiding a few laps before) but I'm not great sprinting on the downhill. I'll give a try or can be last man to launch someone else. 
Guys, there's likely two Kissena prospects coming tomorrow at 7:45am to Prospect park to ride a couple of warm down laps and then join for coffee. Can someone please volunteer to meet them here at the S/F—text me (646) 785 2107 and I'll give these two your cell to coordinate.

Name
Last
Email
2
Peter
Soderberg
1
Antonio
Liang jiang

Thank you!
I’ll text you. Feel free to have them look for us at 7:45
Results? Reports? Scuttlebutt?


TL/DR

32. J.P.
34. Jeff C
37. Eloy
72. John P
74. Patrick

Winning time 1:25:29
Field sprint finish

Good riding by all.  It was good to see Dan in a race again.  

When I got into a seven-man move starting by the temple on the first lap, I was going out there to cover it for Kissena and see how the field responded.  After quickly getting seven seconds, we were closed down.  By John Loehner of Weather Channel no less.  

that told me WC was looking for a sprint.  And that was a bad sign, as so, too, was Brands.  And it was easy to deduce that Montclair was the same, as their guy Juan Pineda was in yellow.  And Jordan as well, since only one of their guys ever looks for a break.

Still, I felt we had to try.  We did try to attack after the first intermediate sprint, which came before the first KoM.  Have to remember that, as going after the second one might have been easier.  Or "easier."

I went first after the first sprint.  Didn't get far.  And the field was intent on closing it down.  I know that some believe just tuck in and wait for the sprint, but I don't think we'd be terribly successful at that.  My interest in initiating a series of attacks one after the other is that most masters racers seem to sit up after an attack or two.  It doesn't matter whether one is better at attacking in particular situations, so long as one is near the front and goes at the moment.  It would have been interesting to see if the field would have taken at least a temporary respite.  But we were going faster than any other Castelli race I've done this year.

There were a few times, when splits started to roll off the front.  Jeff and Patrick got into a few of those.  John got into a move that petered out earlier than I expected.  

I also tried following the guys going for the first KoM for an attack.  And after the second sprint.  And a few other times.

We did try to get it together on the last lap.  But, the field stayed kind of wide for a long time--Brands isn't as strong relative to the field as they were earlier in the year.  I found myself pinned on the left side of the road, unable to move into position to actually contest the finish.  I think moving up has to take place just after the bell and before the downhill, at least with the field moving at the speed it was.

Alas.  
Castelli race this weekend. Who’s in? 

Jim and I are regulars at registration, but are both out of town. Who is willing to pitch in?

will also be out of town at Neversink
I'm in and can help out at reg. 
Plans are cancelled this weekend, can help at reg

if you're helping out at reg please sign up here https://docs.google.com/document/d/1h68kb_QnO2NSAaAd2gradwBk12Q3uw__kjm2yTAv8Zg/edit


I'll be there at reg
Since today was the last of the Castelli series, Charlie had to give the Master's field one last good ribbing. He said something like, "Can you guys pick it up today? I mean, the 5's almost caught you last time." Someone from the back of our field called out, "that's just cold, Charlie"... laughter all around. Everyone was in good spirits.

The roads were still wet and the threat of rain was real, so the race started out very tame. The first couple of laps were easy. Once everyone was confident that their tires were sticking, the pace went up.

I can't recall precisely when, but a break got away very early... probably at 4-5 laps in. It stayed away for some time as a couple of teams (Mineola included) showed up with strong numbers. They were working the front and the field was more than happy to oblige. The pace slowed down again.

A few laps later, we got our asses organized and started to chase. I did a hard turn at the front to close the gap and we got within striking distance. Less than a lap later, the break was caught.

The field forgot we were racing and sat up at 3 to go, then remembered what speed was again and started pushing hard at 2 to go. I was feeling gassed, but I managed to rally myself to stay tucked into a good position in the pack on the 2nd to last climb.

The final lap was fast, but it felt good. The field strung out so we were getting cleaner lines which helped maintain speed. Yacks came up and told me to stick the wheel of one of the Mineola guys because he'd been racing strong lately and was a contender for the day. We worked our way through the pack, sometimes rather aggressively, to get to him.

Good lines were hard to come by, so I had to split from Yacks and take a long outside path to move up. I got within a bicycle length of the guy and bled out of my eyeballs to stay with him on the final climb. As we neared the top, I literally felt like I was going to throw up. I blasted over the KOM line simultaneously trying to maintain power and suppress my growing nausea.

…and then I popped (as in, ran out of gas, not puked). I was able to maintain some speed in the final stretch, but I didn't have the legs left to contest.

In any case, that last lap was probably the most fun I've had racing in Prospect Park.

Then I get home to discover that my power meter died and I got no power data. :-1:
Bump!

The castelli series is starting this weekend.  Who is interested in doing what?

https://www.bikereg.com/castelli-series-round1
Unless something comes up with the baby, I’m plannning on being there (maybe I should make that a permanent caveat for the next several years).

Anyway, I felt better than expected at the L&C race this past weekend, so I’m hoping for the same this weekend.
I'm signed up. Unless there's a last minute shift to do Gravel in CT, I'll be there.
I'm racing mountain bikes Sunday, but will be back for the next L&C Cup. In the meantime...

Volunteer to help with registration for this Sunday's 3/31 Castelli race and race for free. In case the fields close out, make sure to register for the race first. We will work out a system to ensure volunteers get into races soon. 

Charlie needs help with registration and a "Marshal Patroller" volunteers. Registration volunteers show up about an hour before the start and register racers in exchange for a FREE RACE (you get credited to a future park race). The Marshal Patroller rides around the course while the race is going on, making sure there are not hazards in the road, etc. and get a FREE RACE plus $40 cash.  

Sign up to volunteer here.
I"m signed up as well.

Only three?  John Powell, Eloy, JP?
I'm signed up for the Cat-5s. Anyone else wanna race some bikes?