I think this affects us all downstream since the brands design and produce stuff for the pros first before it hits the enthusiast market in volume. Maybe despite the UCI rulings, the mfgs will continue to provide properly sized components on their complete bike builds and/or make a wide range of component sizing available?

GregHoge said:

From what I've seen, most super narrow bars flare out to a more reasonable width in the drops, but it is definitely ackward doing a standing effort on the hoods when they are so narrow.

I guess the counterpoint is if physics is physics is physics, even if a rider requires a 36cm width bar for a proper fit, won't it still be awkward and twitchy for the same sprint accelerations? Or will bike frame/fork/component geometries compensate?

David Yang said:

GregHoge said:

From what I've seen, most super narrow bars flare out to a more reasonable width in the drops, but it is definitely ackward doing a standing effort on the hoods when they are so narrow.

I guess the counterpoint is if physics is physics is physics, even if a rider requires a 36cm width bar for a proper fit, won't it still be awkward and twitchy for the same sprint accelerations? Or will bike frame/fork/component geometries compensate?

I guess a way to change geometries to compensate for narrow bars would be longer stems and more trail.  Though I don't know how much that would compensate.  

https://design-milk.com/ponomarets-launches-eidolon-worlds-lightest-bespoke-ebike/

~$14-15k

You getting one, Kevin?

Also, reminds of Cannondales from the early 90s

I think he was using it Saturday last on Bradley  

I’ll be rolling this out for Grant’s Tomb

Now I'm over here looking at old "modernized" cannondale

What is going on with that last bike? Because I want it.

Does anyone know of a company doing relatively inexpensive steel frames? I have the itch to build a new bike up and if I can source everything for a reasonable price I may just be able to convince myself it's a good idea

Damn that's clever!
https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2025/06/s-rower-turns-smart-trainer-into-smart-rower.html?

Matt Budofsky said:

Does anyone know of a company doing relatively inexpensive steel frames? I have the itch to build a new bike up and if I can source everything for a reasonable price I may just be able to convince myself it's a good idea

Define relatively inexpensive? Also, disc brakes or old school rim brakes?

• Soma comes to mind
• All City can still be found.
• Ritchey forever
• State makes a $450 frame (you can get a carbon fork for a bit more)
• There's always Surly 
• Stinner frames have competitive prices considering their reputation
• Rivendell probably too pricey
• Ebay for cool, old school, and rim brakes (guessing you ride about a 56) 

Hidden in the Eurobike headlines... Stages is back and dealing in the US after Giant bought them a while back 
https://stagescycling.com/en_us/product

Matt Budofsky said:

Does anyone know of a company doing relatively inexpensive steel frames? I have the itch to build a new bike up and if I can source everything for a reasonable price I may just be able to convince myself it's a good idea

What kind of riding you planning with this bike and how modern will the components be?

Some notes on tubesets if you're buying vintage - the skinny Columbus SL/SP and Reynolds 531 stuff will probably be too whippy for your size/weight. Reynold 853 is generally stiffer like what you're used to while still retaining the steel feel.

Also the vast majority of vintage road and cross bikes will be limited in how wide/tall your tires can be. Even with canti brazes some are funky as the "widest" brake spring hole may not let you run rims wider than 20mm without some finagling.

For what it's worth, I love my new old Ritchey Swiss cross.

@eloy and @David Yang Thanks for the insight/suggestions! I perused some of the State and Ritchey frames the other day, but wasn't sure what other companies were still in the steel game (and it appears quite a few luckily). I'm not entirely sure what the purpose of the bike would be quite yet, but I'm leaning towards gravel/off road. I watched Trace Velo build an AliExpress Steel bike which was sort of the genesis of this train of thought. At this point it's all a fun window shopping exercise until (and if) I can convince myself this is a good idea.

As far as price of things, I want to be sub $1k frame (preferably around $500-700 so the State Frame is right in there), and then bargain hunting on eBay for either an old stock or lightly used now older gen wireless 1x rival group (which would either go on this bike or my cross bike, and that would then let me move the mechanical groupset on there to this hypothetical new bike). If I went this route, I'd be forced to stick to disc brakes (which I love and would be quite happy with). I also have an older rim brake force 22 groupo kicking around in my garage so I could always go canti/rim as well.

Inspiration 

https://dariopegoretti.com/pegoretti-elio?ref=escapecollective.com

I ride a Fairlight, which is steel, framesets run more than your budget, but I endorse the steel. I have a rim brake Surly pacer that I leave out west that is a delight to ride and pretty versatile. I feel like with a bit of watching a good deal on an Allcity or Soma could pop up. 

Anyone know if you cant fit 28mm tires on a CAD 10 Rim brake frame

The interwebs suggest that it can fit a 25 easily, and that a 28 a bit more tightly depending on the brake calipers and rim inner width, and depending too a bit if the tire inflates accurately to 28. Most describe the brake caliper as the limiter.

https://www.reddit.com/r/cycling/comments/1dcg30e/tire_clearance_caad_10_56/

Mark Taylor said:

Anyone know if you cant fit 28mm tires on a CAD 10 Rim brake frame

I can test out when I get home but front should easily accommodate 28s - rear might rub with frame flex, this is using hed jet c2 rims which are inner 19mm outer 23mm widths. Skinny rims like og open pros might have an extra 2mm clearance.

Depending on how tall the tire is, where the widest part is and how perfectly dead centered the rim is dished 28s should fit. The tightest spot is the chain stays and I measure 33-35mm around where the tire would be the widest.

For reference the Conti 5k AS tubeless I have measure 25.7mm and my wheel seems dished a bit toward the drive side so 28 or 29mm would be a close call. 2-3mm clearance on either side is what you'd be looking at.

BTW I have a later production CAAD10 size 52 with internal top tube routing. I believe earlier models had external cable routing so can't guarantee there weren't other slight changes.

FWIW, I ran Conti' 4000s 25mm on my CAAD10, and between the rim width and stretch, the tires measured at about 27.5mm after a few days.  And they had plenty of room.  

The promise of custom fit for (admittedly high) standard race helmet prices is very enticing. Waiting for orange to be an option...

https://kavhelmets.com/products/rhoan-core-2025-q1

David Yang said:

The promise of custom fit for (admittedly high) standard race helmet prices is very enticing. Waiting for orange to be an option...

https://kavhelmets.com/products/rhoan-core-2025-q1

Very ‘edgy’, lotta straight lines.

My odd shaped head is not so far off...

David Yang said:

The promise of custom fit for (admittedly high) standard race helmet prices is very enticing. Waiting for orange to be an option...

https://kavhelmets.com/products/rhoan-core-2025-q1

That's weird.  I've definitely seen this helmet in orange...

I reached out to Kav to see if they would work with us as a club

Any solutions for a home-brew bike-fit jig? I've finally got a position I really like on my gravel bike and I'd like to transfer it to road & cross bikes.