L&C Cup - Forum Archive

Apr 04, 2014 at 03:55 PM

Jeebus. It's going around huh? Glad you're ok.

I have a sore throat/sinus shit starting (as usual), so not sure what help I'll be in the race, but I'll be there to work reg and see what happens.

Bruce van-Schalkwyk

Apr 04, 2014 at 04:31 PM

Damn. Sorry to hear that, but glad you're ok. I agree with Owens, it seems like this is happening a lot lately.

Jules

Apr 04, 2014 at 04:46 PM

Damn Phil, rest up. The first two days afterwards are always the worst. Hope you feel better soon.

jim_nelson

Apr 04, 2014 at 04:51 PM

Bummer Phil, feel better.

Thanks Craig.

Phil Maronilla

Apr 04, 2014 at 05:42 PM

Thanks all.

Myles

Apr 04, 2014 at 05:59 PM

Don't let me down tonight I still have you on team E..
On Apr 4, 2014 1:42 PM, "Phillip Maronilla" <

PatrickGrehan

Apr 04, 2014 at 07:45 PM

Phil - That sucks. Glad to hear you're okay. You didn't mention the bike - hope that is okay as well.

Phil Maronilla

Apr 04, 2014 at 08:00 PM

Thanks Patrick. Luckily, not a scratch on the bike, nor the helmet (I didn't hit my head). I guess my buttock was the crash protection for the bike..

Dan Reiners

Apr 04, 2014 at 09:18 PM

Feel better Phil and the rest of you I look forward to seeing the rest of you out there tomorrow morning.

Btw did everybody see Charlie's email about the flooding at the bottom of the park? It sounds like he may cancel the race.

vlad

Apr 04, 2014 at 09:32 PM

Doubt it

mperlberg

Apr 05, 2014 at 12:40 PM

I flatted out in 1/2 a lap.

Mengoni put 4/6 in the break and took 1-2-3-4 in the finish.

JP got in the chase group. I'm pretty sure he came in around 12th.

mperlberg

Apr 05, 2014 at 12:40 PM

In Cat 4 news, looks like Patrick took the KOM from a long break, and maybe 8th in the finish.

Jules

Apr 05, 2014 at 01:10 PM

My pathetic attempt at trying to volunteer this morning, in Haiku:

Tubeless wheel is flat

Jankey thumb can't swap a wheel

Home, diapers await.

Ryan J

Apr 05, 2014 at 02:13 PM

mperlberg said:
Mengoni put 4/6 in the break and took 1-2-3-4 in the finish.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVsknoivy1Q

JohnMalcolmson

Apr 05, 2014 at 02:23 PM

Go Patrick! Reportz!

@Perlberg that sucks, what was your tire (and tube) choice?

@Jules I christen thee thumb:

Old Stanky Jank Lebron Crumble Thumb.

@Mengoni This will not stand!

Bruce van-Schalkwyk

Apr 05, 2014 at 02:54 PM

I finished the race.

I had two goals this morning, to win, and to finish. I accomplished one of them.

With a later start time of 6:30, I rolled out of my house with plenty of time to spare, which was lucky since I hit a nasty pothole in the pitch dark and flatted my rear tire. I changed it in the dark and promptly blew the tube with the CO2 - it was seated between the tire and rim. I had a second tube, thinking I might take a ride after the race, put that on and burned my arms with the little pump I had also brought in my bag.

The road was wet but no rain this morning, and it was chilly enough to see my breath. But once in the park, I warmed to see the orange cones and High Speed Race signs.

The cat 4 group was relatively small, though team CIS had almost as many teammates as us. At the start, a small break happened at the top of the hill, which we pulled back. I was riding in the rear of the pack and, on lap two, watched another break form and take off. An 8 or 9 man group, with Patrick, which turned out to be the winning break. We kept them in sight for a lap, and guys would throw themselves at it by themselves or two at a time, but no one had the fitness to bridge, and a lap later, they were out of sight.

So, the rest of the race guys were throwing themselves off the front, mostly at the top of the hill, and just after the bottom of the big hill and then backing off. Harry stayed up front and I kept working my way up to him, and Jim and I rode together for most of the race, I think. And then there were the flats. Dan flatted while talking with Jim. Aaron flatted. Others dropped out. Jim turned to me at one point and said we had almost done a 9 minute lap! So, the fitness overall was low and with the break out front, the race was civil, with guys punching it now and again. On the last lap, I yelled out for everyone to have a safe finish, all the top spots were taken. The pace picked up and people got way to close to each other at one point and the right side slowed and moved over, but it was a solid finish and a good early season race.

Patrick takes the dots!

Coffee and muffins after. It was great to be out there this morning, great to ride with teammates I haven't seen or raced with in 6 or 9 months, nice to be able to finish the race. Now, to start working on higher levels of fitness and get back in the game. We have a jersey to defend, and several others to take back.

JohnMalcolmson

Apr 05, 2014 at 03:10 PM

Bruce van-Schalkwyk said:

I was riding in the rear of the pack and, on lap two, < not to harsh on you Bruce, but not easy to win from here.

Joel Rodriguez

Apr 05, 2014 at 03:12 PM

Awesome time out there! Had my first race today (L&C) -- There were 3 of us in the cat 5s (Chi and I’m really bad remembering names.apologies).

Good size field with a good pace throughout. A few other guys mentioned it was faster than normal for this time a year and considering it was a bit wet. There were several break attempts - Two guys broke away at mid point, one fell back but the other was gone, pretty much powered solo the entire way to win it - But the field kept a pretty aggressive pace throughout.

Stuck to the plan and the good bits of advise from many of you, MPerlberg, Marc, Eric R, and few others in the past (so, big thanks). I kept myself in the front half the entire time, shielded with steady consistency -- BUT... on the last lap, I was convinced I had plenty of legs (so i thought)... I positioned myself second from the front of the field, he steps aside and I take the front (big mistake) I led for a good while, knowing very well I would pay for it (Stupid and i knew it) ... then of course the surge came in. I ended up in the front half somewhere.

There was a solo crash to be reported. He was ok.

Overall, very happy (check). Lesson learned (check). Sorry, I could hang out for coffee. next time.

I officially have the bug. ...and great to meet some of you in person finally. Congrats, Patrick.

Cheers!

Bruce van-Schalkwyk

Apr 05, 2014 at 03:24 PM

Yep, John, I agree. I hung back for a lap to suss things out. After lap two when I got my legs back and realized I was totally fine, I moved up and stayed in the top 10 for the rest of the race - not in my report above. I led the peloton for half a lap and others refused to come up around me until I slowed ridiculously. I knew I didn't have the fitness to cover any jumps, but thought about it every time someone made a move. I couldn't go with them, so I practiced watching for it, positioning myself to go with them, counter, or where I would make the jump myself. And in the end, I've got words, not results, so hope to reverse that this season.

Congrats, Joel! And Chi, Jay. Nice job.

Dan Reiners

Apr 05, 2014 at 07:04 PM

Bruce, you did yourself proud for somebody who is coming off an injury in a small, wet and nervous race. You missed the break, but we had a guy in the break so the rest of our job was sitting in and following wheels that were trying to bridge. You patrolled the front and kept the field from doing something dumb. You rode well, stayed upright and finished the race, I would call that a victory for your goals.

Now we have to capture the other jerseys and kick some serious ass this season.

Good work gents!

PatrickGrehan

Apr 06, 2014 at 12:23 AM

I've been exhausted all week and 5 hours of sleep last night did not help. I figured that in addition to captaining the Cat 4 team I would spend a couple of well timed bullets figuring that it was I would be able to muster. It was not to be.

Funny how all our grand plans get turned on their heads. Not only did we not start with the peloton crushing squad due to Jeff's illness, Phil's accident and other uncontrollable events, but several of our teammates were sidelined by the potholes of Prospect Park.

Immediately after the whistle Aaron and another guy rolled off the front and had a pretty good gap. The pack was in no hurry but they were brought back after the pace increased later that lap. As we crested the hill on lap two, four guys were pushing the pace and being only a few bike lengths ahead I decided to mark the move by spinning up to them. I figured we were going nowhere and was not planning on burning any matches unless necessary. Soon after I noticed we were 7 then 9 and eventually I think we were 12 strong. The first two laps were a disaster of shouting as some guys (including the guys who ended up placing 1st and 2nd overall) seemed clueless about how to ride in an efficient pace line.

Anyway, the group became disorganized as we approached the first sprint but then picked up the pace and worked better together from that point on. I did not contest the green jersey, instead focusing on the KOM. I took a long flyer on the first one and had a sizable lead. On the second one, which was at laps to go, I was on second wheel at an even tempo until near the top when I sensed the BVF who had gotten 2nd on the first KOM accelerate. I jumped and passed him when he called out to let me know he was sitting up - we both needed to conserve our energy for the finish.

I was pretty toasted at this point but felt like I still had something in my legs. On the last lap the attacks started. So much for recovering. I was not able to gauge how far back the pack was as the sun was rising and couldn't see anything at the turn beyond the hill. The break (we were 10 now) had slowed and I decided to push the pace down the hill. I figured this would not take too much energy and let me sit on afterwards. As soon as we got to the temple a couple of attacks went. I was about 8th back when we got to the traffic light and the sprint started. I picked the wrong wheel to be on, but in the end the responsibility was mine: I just did not have the snap.

By the way it was AWESOME to hear all the support out there including the teammates at the finish line, Keith and Jeff at the KOM, and even Mike P who was riding up the hill yelling encouragement at me. I am also appreciative of the guys in the field who disrupted the chasing efforts.

Overall, I am stoked to have been in a winning break at Prospect and to have taken home the KOM Jersey in a decisive fashion. I would have loved to place better, but perhaps this is the Kissena curse.

Tomorrow I will write up my post race debrief wearing my "road captain" hat.

JohnMalcolmson

Apr 06, 2014 at 02:50 AM

@Bruce You definitely didn't screw up. And dude, you busted your hip what seems like yesterday so my comment above isn't even close to fair.

Phil Maronilla

Apr 07, 2014 at 05:50 PM

A few KCC pictures here from Saturday.

http://www.super-rival.com/lc1

PatrickGrehan

Apr 08, 2014 at 01:32 AM

Post race debrief: What can we learn from the first L&C cup race?

Shit happens

First of all, we went in with concerns that we would dominate the field. Clearly illness, flats, and and moving cars skewered any chance of that happening. There is no way to be ready for all possibilities. The best we can do is have flexible plans and good communications.

Playing the odds

I cannot remember an L&C cup 4 race over the past 5 years that ended with a breakaway from that early in the race. For that reason alone, it should have been good bet not to be concerned with the break. Usually, the competition for the jerseys usually inspires teams to close down most breaks. However… this week was a perfect storm:

Few teams had strong representation that could pull back a break
It was the first race so on one was defending a jersey yet
The breakaway had a wide range of teams represented which discouraged chasing
A smaller than usual field
Battenkill

I should tell you to bet against it happening again, however, on Sunday at Bethel a two man break launched on the second lap. I said to myself that it couldn’t possibly happen two days in a row. I was wrong.

Breaks

We should aspire to have representation in most breaks. Of course we did have representation in this break, but 1/12 (08%) riders is lousy odds when we consider that we started at something like 20-25% representation in the field. Ideally, if the group had been healthy and flat free we should have had a few guys jump onto the wheels of the guys bridging to the break. You would have an excuse not to pull through given the teammate up the road so if the bridge attempt failed then you wouldn’t waste too much energy. Better yet if the bridge attempt succeeded then you just doubled our chances sprints and finish.

Before the race I had stated that we were going to mark breaks in the second half of the race. This was a tactical decision because I did not think we had the depth to mark breaks during the whole race and was not concerned about the early breaks. Glad I did not listen to myself. While the chances of a long distance break staying away again are slim, when we have enough racers we will assign guys to cover breaks throughout the race.

Chasing

If the break had gone without a teammate we would have needed to organize a chase to pull it back. No flyers - that would just burn up our legs - but even pace lines with short rotations.

Blocking

Harry told me that the team did a good job of blocking. Not slowing down once in front, but simply letting gaps open up and not participating in a chase. This sounds exactly right.

Flexibility

Having the road captain roll away with the break was not part of the pre-race plan. In this kind of situation (or if I had gotten a flat, etc.) it is important for experienced teammates to step up and make calls on the road. I can’t reiterate enough the value of riding up to your teammates and talking about what is going on.

The next race

We will have a jersey to defend and a larger contingent for the next race. Next week I will post some preliminary plans - maybe the reach will cooperate this time...

Phil Maronilla

Apr 08, 2014 at 02:09 AM

Well said @Patrick. Looking forward to the next race.

mugwump

Apr 08, 2014 at 02:23 AM

Good recap Patrick.

We had: Andy, Condon, Mike, Vlad, Yacks. Good to see Condon and Yacks stepping up to the big time. Mengoni had everyone. Jordan had most everyone. United had several.

Mike flatted on the first lap. Bummer that.

I thought the field had enough teams that an early move wouldn't nwork. But as I was watching to see how guys were on the lap riding into the first KoM, there was an attack and it looked good. I think two Mengoni were up there, a Jordan rider, some others. Then a second group started to get away with two more Mengoni, Yacks says something about that looking serious. I went a few moments later.

I went from the bottom of the hill, caught two BH guys, dumped one, kept going, picked up a few riders from behind, and a few who dropped off the first group.

And we had a group. Three Jordans, two Uniteds, a Mengoni (everhard), a BH, Rafael Meran (Foundation) and a few others. We had a 20-second gap to overcome. With the exception of Tony Taylor (Jordan) and Aaron Katin (BH),few of the guys were riding to catch. Everhard had no reason to work. Jermaine Burrowes wasn't riding well. Paul Burrowes didn't take a single pull and was dropped. Meran was weak. Two other guys were uneven.

I made a mistake in putting in efforts to try to catch and it took me too long to figure it out. With three to go, I think it was Jermaine who hit a dog in the road and crashed. With two to go, Franklin of Jordan put in a attack. He had occasionally pulled. Problem was, if I rode up to him solo, he'd sit on me. But Aaron decided to go after on the bell, so that brought Franklin back. But he went again. It was weak, but I wasn't going to be the one to chase.

When we got to the descent, I decided to drop back and sit on Everhard, Rafael, and Stalin. These guys were looking at each other and were going to sprint hard.

THey went. I wasn't good enough to match, and, to my frustration, wasn't good enough to beat a guy who had tried to go early.

11th it was. the dick spot. I thought they paid out 12 last year.

FWIW, I was second in the old man's competition. The first guy was Eugene Boronow, the race winner. Don't know if this means I should show up to the next L&C to do a day in grey.

vlad

Apr 08, 2014 at 02:30 AM

Oh dude, you gotta wear the grey!

Dan Reiners

Apr 08, 2014 at 11:37 AM

Patrick,

In your absence from the main field. Jim stepped up and kept up with the team captaining duties keeping track of who was where and making sure the front was being patrolled. He and I were chatting about what our next moves would be when I had an unfortunate flat.

David Yang

Apr 14, 2014 at 04:25 PM

Alrighty folks, L&C Cup this Saturday:
https://www.bikereg.com/lucarelli--castaldi-cup

We need a few more volunteers for registration table and marshall duties:
http://kissenacycling.vanillaforums.com/discussion/comment/59327/#Comment_59327

twoyacks

Apr 15, 2014 at 12:25 AM

does this race start at 6:00 a.m. ?