Feb 07, 2014 at 03:34 AM
Thanks all for your thoughts...it helps!
Cyclocross!
Thanks all for your thoughts...it helps!
Feb 07, 2014 at 01:16 PM
I've been trying to price out cyclocross options for some time now. What I would ideally do is buy an 11-speed groupset, upgrade my road bike, and move my road bike's drivetrain over to a cross bike. But doing that for less than what we can get brand new from Cannondale is proving difficult.
Feb 07, 2014 at 02:07 PM
Brendan I recommend keeping compatible group sets for as long as you can get away with
Feb 07, 2014 at 02:20 PM
I'm constantly flabbergasted at how much individual components, like cassettes cost. I would guess that the bulk purchasing power that the big companies have is the primary reason that complete bikes are so much more affordable that custom jobbies.Brendan Rigby said:I've been trying to price out cyclocross options for some time now. What I would ideally do is buy an 11-speed groupset, upgrade my road bike, and move my road bike's drivetrain over to a cross bike. But doing that for less than what we can get brand new from Cannondale is proving difficult.
Feb 09, 2014 at 03:31 PM
Bertucco, you've also got to consider the emerging thru-axle trend: http://velonews.competitor.com/2014/02/bikes-and-tech/first-look-new-focus-mares-cx-and-its-innovative-thru-axles_316278
Giant's top of the line bike had one this year.
Re: components, you might be surprised to know that Amazon.com Prime often (but not always) has cheaper bike parts than other, bicycle-focused, online retailers.
Feb 09, 2014 at 04:13 PM
Brendan, yeah, this thru-axle thing is really throwing me for a loop. Surprise, surprise but none of the cycling mags have done a good enough job explaining what this is for this particular ludite. I just am having trouble visualizing/understanding. Other than "stiffer+quicker wheel changes=more better"
I saw a tweet that Edwin Bull is off to China to work on carbon fiber bike designs (silent cheer), I wonder if the Full Tilt Boogie 2.0 will have such a thing?
I saw a tweet that Edwin Bull is off to China to work on carbon fiber bike designs (silent cheer), I wonder if the Full Tilt Boogie 2.0 will have such a thing?
Feb 09, 2014 at 04:25 PM
@Marc yes, all the new bikes will be Thru axle.
Feb 09, 2014 at 04:27 PM
I responded in the gear & tech thread
Feb 09, 2014 at 04:32 PM
wiseBrendan Rigby said:I responded in the gear & tech thread
Feb 09, 2014 at 05:24 PM
While I am certain there is some data to support the claims re: thru axle somewhere, it seems to me more never ending bike industry hype than anything.
Faster wheel changes? Who changes wheels? That's what pit bikes are for. Surely pit people can open a quick release before you do a complete lap.
Nothing against technology, but change for change's sake is unnecessary. BTW, Sven Nys won both races this weekend with cantilevers. Legs and training are going to win more races than stiffer axles..
Feb 09, 2014 at 05:37 PM
@Mark and Brendan - one thought on the recent discussion bikes for next season: frame geometry is a big deal in cross. The biggest difference between manufacturers can usually be found just by looking at the bottom bracket height. I have discovered that I VASTLY prefer the designs with lower BB height. The higher BB height is apparently more of a European thing, while the lower heights are apparently better suited to "American" style courses (whatever that means - maybe more technical turns?) and makes for less awkward remounts. I've sampled Ridley (relatively high BB), Kona (relatively high BB), Bianchi (relatively low BB) and Van Dessel (lowest BB I've found, though the new Trek and Specialized frames are both close and maybe the same now), and the lower BB felt much better to me through the turns. Of course, that's just me, but I've heard similar sentiment from others who have compared the two styles.
Either way, I would encourage you to compare the different styles to see if the difference is as material for you as it was for me.
Feb 09, 2014 at 06:12 PM
@Joaquin - HEAR HEAR. I've had two revelatory moments on a bike with respect to performance:
1. Race wheels
2. Low-BB CX bike
Feb 09, 2014 at 09:53 PM
BB height is an interesting issue. If I recall correctly from an old conversation I had with JP, the high BB style was left-over from the days of pedals and toe clips/cages when you needed more clearance.
But now I'm reading (possibly in that "new Mares" article) that a higher BB height is good for increased clearance for tight turns.
I don't know.
I do know, however, that it's going to make sense for me to try a couple of rigs before I buy. So that might mean harassing you some of my teammates of the 54cm ish size range to let me do a hot lap or two before or better after your race! (if time allows naturally)
Feb 09, 2014 at 11:16 PM
Ah yes, BB height and thru-axle. Great topics.
Yes, A number of American builders feel the higher BB height is a holdover from the days of clips and straps. But then, it could help (a bit) if you need to pedal on tight, slow turns or like to jump barriers, the higher BB could help. I'm a fan of the lower myself. Ask yourself how far you pedal into a turn and if you've ever hit a pedal. I have both on the road and in cx, but I don't think it's holding me back in either place.
When it's a thru-axle, it's just that. The piece is the axle your wheel's bearings roll on. The larger diameter axle can make the fork blades stiffer for a given weight, or lighter at the same stiffness.
It's kind of like loosening up your quick release when you have lawyers tabs. When you open the qr, you turn it counter clockwise. The advantage is that it isn't threaded as far as your typical quick release and you don't need to do it with two hands, because the threaded nut is built into the fork.
So once you have the right wheel, to take out the wheel, you'll open the qr, turn it counter-clockwise a few revolutions, and pull the axle out at the quick release. The wheel then drops out of the fork or frame.
Problem is, you need thru-axle specific wheels.
Worst of all, there are some hybrid thru-axles, so they split the difference between what I described and the regular qr.
BTW, it's probably inevitable for disc brakes. That the axle is going though a solid end rather than dropouts means that the wheels will have a harder time twisting out under heavy braking (if you didn't know it, grabbing a rotor by the dropout exerts lots of force on the wheel, pushing it down). Currently, lawyer tabs and stronger quick releases are working ok on cross bikes. But they don't work as well on the road (more force), and the thru-axle design could lighten up both the wheels and the frames.
(and as others have written, good race tubulars for cx are far more valuable than a slightly better bike and clinchers)
Feb 09, 2014 at 11:25 PM
I can't imagine needing clearance height in any of our courses. I'm a terrible bike handler. I crashed in almost every race and got 2nd place in 7 races due to my poor turning skills - with older geometry.
The van Dessel has been night and day for me. Ridiculous how much improvement I've felt. Since I got it I haven't crashed once in the 180 turns which were always my weakness. I feel fast in the non hairpin turns. I've made up ground in technical sections and off camber.
I would never consider a bike unless it had similar bb clearance.
Best,
-Eric
Eric J. Robertson
Mr. X Gotham
214 Sullivan Street, 2nd Floor
NY NY 10012
Office 212.993.7878
Mobile 917.509.4696
iPhone 5: Better, faster, stronger - just like Steve Austin
The van Dessel has been night and day for me. Ridiculous how much improvement I've felt. Since I got it I haven't crashed once in the 180 turns which were always my weakness. I feel fast in the non hairpin turns. I've made up ground in technical sections and off camber.
I would never consider a bike unless it had similar bb clearance.
Best,
-Eric
Eric J. Robertson
Mr. X Gotham
214 Sullivan Street, 2nd Floor
NY NY 10012
Office 212.993.7878
Mobile 917.509.4696
iPhone 5: Better, faster, stronger - just like Steve Austin
Feb 10, 2014 at 12:55 AM
Can someone insert a picture of Robertson in the sand at Granogue?
Feb 10, 2014 at 01:04 AM
Marc Bertucco said:
BB height is an interesting issue. If I recall correctly from an old conversation I had with JP, the high BB style was left-over from the days of pedals and toe clips/cages when you needed more clearance.
But now I'm reading (possibly in that "new Mares" article) that a higher BB height is good for increased clearance for tight turns.
I don't know.
I do know, however, that it's going to make sense for me to try a couple of rigs before I buy. So that might mean harassing you some of my teammates of the 54cm ish size range to let me do a hot lap or two before or better after your race! (if time allows naturally)
Hotlaps for Hotlist!
Feb 10, 2014 at 06:07 AM
Hey, looking for bad-ass pictures of cross riders in the snow. Specifically, wasn't there one of Kayt around here somewhere? I can't seem to find it.
Feb 10, 2014 at 06:12 AM
I found the Kayt one after all...still will accept others. Working on keeping the Supercross FB page running.
Feb 10, 2014 at 05:48 PM
From a blizzard at Augusta a few years ago. Photo courtesy at Eloy.
Feb 10, 2014 at 06:14 PM
Marc you know we have a huge set of photos on Flickr, right?
Feb 10, 2014 at 07:09 PM
Yup...thanks for the reminder. Will look there too.Jules said:Marc you know we have a huge set of photos on Flickr, right?
Feb 10, 2014 at 08:07 PM
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Feb 11, 2014 at 01:08 PM
Another request for the Kissena CX hive-mind.
I'm kicking around an idea for a fun, light-hearted evergreen essay (that hopefully I can get published somewhere other than a blog to which I have administrative rights ;-) about CX that addresses the "shock and awe" that announcers and others feign when realizing there's "someone from Brooklyn" or another dense metropolitan center is at the front of a cross race.
Obviously, I know us well. But who are the other top city kids/teams crossing it up. For example there's some skinny King Kog dude shredding it in the Bs, right? As many names and/or teams that you can think of off the top of your head would be helpful. (You don't have to know/list their palmares, crossresults will confirm or deny that for me as I put pen to paper.)
Thanks in advance!
Feb 11, 2014 at 01:24 PM
If they don't ride for Kissena, they are dead and nameless to me.
Feb 11, 2014 at 02:28 PM
Hey Marc
I think the King Kog guy you're thinking of is Cooper Ray.
Cicli Devotion is a fairly strong city based team.
I think this relates. I read somewhere in a blog about cross attracting musicians (active and inactive) of the indy and punk variety because it comports with their DIY ethos/world view…..cross is pretty "punk rock" And musicians tend to land in urban centers….because that's where the music is/audiences are.
Feb 11, 2014 at 03:17 PM
@Marc. Maybe you can tie Nelson Vails into this somehow. Maybe not 'cross, but plenty of 'shock and awe'
Feb 11, 2014 at 04:38 PM
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Feb 11, 2014 at 06:09 PM
Yes absolutely, Dan and Evan are good examples of dudes who live in the city and still rock the cross courses. Naturally Mike Garrigan fits that mold too.Gwynna Smith said:Would you include people like Dan Chabanov and Evan Murphy? I know Dan isn't from NYC, but he's a city boy now. Not sure where Evan is from.
Feb 11, 2014 at 06:33 PM
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